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 Post subject: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2012 10:06 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 10:36 am
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went to all the trouble of crafting for two days to get 115% curse immune with nice crafts, only to find out that I can still be cursed with that new confuse curse. Was this intentional or just an oversight.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2012 11:53 pm 
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God I hate that fucking curse.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:26 am 

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That curse ignores all other curse rules. Period. It can't be removed by anything other than time. At the start of patch I lobbied (unsuccessfully) for a reduction in effect, as it affects so many things. IAS, FCR, and up to -56% phys res. Unless you have at least 66% FCR you can't cast while affected. I've actually seen my phys res when combined with amp drop to -110%.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 8:18 am 
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This is because in the files its not set as a curse. It is a state so there is no way to cure it of be immune to it.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 8:59 am 

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dew wrote:
This is because in the files its not set as a curse. It is a state so there is no way to cure it of be immune to it.


Necros should be able to cast this on champs IMO.


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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 1:10 pm 

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While it generally annoys me when it's casted from shamans in a1/a3, it really makes some areas/bosses harder. Not much more exciting in the realm of random mods than when Hell Darkness comes cursed and his blades pop that confuse curse on ya. Good times on HC.

As far as it being bypassed by CI, I don't really see the problem there. CI is extremely powerful and certain assassin melee builds will probably need a good eye kept on them in the upcoming patch.


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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 1:49 pm 
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Actually all curses are a state as well. What causes the curse reduction mechanics to probably work is either one of two things. It's either A) a hardcoded listing of state ID's that must be used in order for curse duration reduction to work since it only effects those specific state ID's... or B) curse reduction only affects a certain state grouping ID which most of the curses belong under (but the mon decrep which can currently stack with other curses currently doesn't belong under this state grouping ID).

If the mondecrep was placed under the same state grouping ID as the rest of the curses then it would be impossible for it to stock with other curses for sure (and it may just enable mondecrep to be effected by curse reduction).


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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:47 pm 
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Actually its a column in states.txt that controls this no hard code issue. remove it from any state that is applied via curse or shrine and it will not be affected by curse resistance. but if you remove it then curses and shrines could be stacked. mondecrep uses the confuse state, check the file and you will see the boolean for it being labeled as a curse if missing.
So again i Say its not really a curse and any other curse can be stacked with it.
None of the curse states are grouped at all again this is controlled by the curse boolean. here the stacking effect is nullified by a hard codded function looking for this boolean. But hey you are right curses are states, but not all states are curses only if the curse boolean is set.

Finally the curable boolean is not set on it and this is what is keeping npcs from removing it. I Dont see an issue with being able to go back to town and get healed from it. I just r/j once everything is dead since it seems to last forever, just like slow missiles.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 4:13 pm 

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dew wrote:
Finally the curable boolean is not set on it and this is what is keeping npcs from removing it. I Dont see an issue with being able to go back to town and get healed from it. I just r/j once everything is dead since it seems to last forever, just like slow missiles.
The one place I find it especially annoying is Castle of Destruction, as each level those Lich's cast it. Couple that with things like WSG's, Torture demons, and some of the myriad of others down there and it's more frustrating than anything. Even without that curse, that area can be a pain. Add to the fact you have monsters (Lich) casting blizz from the other side of walls, and even with a fair amount of frw, you're in turtle mode. Having to r/j in Castle makes an already tedious area, even longer.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 6:58 pm 

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If it acts like a curse, then its a curse and I should be immune, otherwise make it a aura and give it all those rediculous mods instead.

Ci means I have to sacrifice some 20% dr from armor, 9k per hit damage, and max fcr bp on a mental sin (which is fucking huge btw thats almost a third of my total if I wasnt ci), and I have to wear what at best would be considered dog shit if it was unique or even rare armor. On the plus side it does hold four sockets and I rolled ten armors the best wasnt "to bad" with 1159 defence before one diamond to achieve 1459 defence and three uber rubies.

I'm just saying that if a thing costs you almost a third of your damage, at least 1500 defence before cos, and 3 skills...........it should kick ass and take names.

This gentlemen does not take names.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 1:04 pm 

Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 10:45 am
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necros should get this as a skill their "confuse" blows ass


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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 1:13 pm 
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Imo the necro confuse should make the monsters stronger so they can kill each other. Since another curse can stack with the necros confuse also it could become another build. Like a curse/ce necro.

Cast confuse then stack amp, then ce your ass off

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 2:55 pm 

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why not just grant the curse a 1 yard aura buff so that monster gets a dmg/hp/ias etc buff

as it is 90% of necros use LR or amp, most people even complain if you use decrep, the rest of necros curses are largely unused and should be tweaked perhaps


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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:06 pm 

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dew wrote:
Imo the necro confuse should make the monsters stronger so they can kill each other. Since another curse can stack with the necros confuse also it could become another build. Like a curse/ce necro.

Cast confuse then stack amp, then ce your ass off
This curse as a necro curse on a summon-mancer, apply amp and CE away. They'd fall like domino's. Look at all the shit applied when you're cursed with it, add that to confuse only allow 1 monster confused but multiples hit with the status effect ;)

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:08 pm 
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Because then it would have to be an aura and not a curse. But it can be done in its current form. Would make for interesting gameplay b/c they could still choose to attack you.

Life tap doesn't need changed b/c in new patch life tap allows for better leech over using amp. So a tank build with high leech and life tap being used can tank better than a summon.

Dim vision is under used and is great to use when mfing solo with a bonemancer.
Decrep imo should get its stats increase from other curses and leveling it should just increase duration/slow/radius
I would like to see a cursemancer possible

I can do it if people are interested.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:13 pm 
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kwikster wrote:
dew wrote:
Imo the necro confuse should make the monsters stronger so they can kill each other. Since another curse can stack with the necros confuse also it could become another build. Like a curse/ce necro.

Cast confuse then stack amp, then ce your ass off
This curse as a necro curse on a summon-mancer, apply amp and CE away. They'd fall like domino's. Look at all the shit applied when you're cursed with it, add that to confuse only allow 1 monster confused but multiples hit with the status effect ;)


I never said makke it like mondecrep, that's just screaming op if it was like that.what I'm proposing would make a cursemancer that could possibly kill trash. Just :D another build option not reinventing summonmancers.

It would make the curse a duel edged sword b/c even confused they could still choose to attack you but they would do more damage.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:18 pm 

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what about a "rage/ beserk" curse give monster extra dmg/speed but attack random targets


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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 4:57 pm 
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Decrep was the most best choice 90% of the time on our first run people don't realize how good it is.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 5:07 pm 
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blinky99 wrote:
what about a "rage/ beserk" curse give monster extra dmg/speed but attack random targets

So a confuse curse that gives ed/ias? Hmmm maybe I forgot to mention that.............


@lockdown

Yes decrep did work the best. But don't tell everyone our secrets. Most on sc atleast always think pure dps is the best. Defensive/slow modz 4 teh noobs

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 7:41 pm 

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You decrep boys would fit well on HC. Sadly even on HC a lot of necros(even summoners) hardly go beyond amp. Nothing like asking a level 90+ necro for some decrep/lr/weaken love and getting nada.
dew wrote:
Decrep imo should get its stats increase from other curses and leveling it should just increase duration/slow/radius

decrep already gets .5% pierce/slow per hard point, or are you aware of this? I think you're basically proposing some sort of synergies type thing for decrep? Sorry for the retard questions I get easily confused.

I wouldn't mind seeing the curse tree get some love though, outside of amp/crep/lr you rarely see anything else being used. Weaken/confuse sometimes comes into play on HC if the necro is smart enough.

As far as the mondecrep goes do people really wanna see it changed that bad? It's in a very small number of areas and sub bosses, and it actually makes Baal's Castle somewhat difficult. I'd even love to see that curse on more endgame stuff, like Samhain/Baal. Hell Baal is a complete pussy, and Samhain is pretty weak for his reward. I'm probably the minority on this but a man can dream.


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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 8:57 pm 
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yes but im suggesting making the changes i proposed along with decrep only getting the amp and weaken effect based on hard points into other skills. essentially making a curse/support necro for bosses that could also use curses to some what effectively kill trash with maybe max dk or 1 pt golems with max golem mastery.

I agree on mondecrep it adds the needed difficulty on the way to baal and other areas that you could just run through with out it.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 2:41 am 
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I may be coming to HC I have to fix a lot of stuff for my D2 to even work.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:02 pm 

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what if decrep also had some sort of life drain effect on monsters [psn or what not], that would make it a pretty useful curse,

-that way you could give it a synergy and you'd actually have a curse that causes damage and can directly kill monsters


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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:21 pm 
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Only thing I can do is give a curse negative hpregen if you want direct a direct damage curse. Scaling it right would be a pain in the ass. Then getting a skill decription to display it right would be worse.....

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 2:40 pm 

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just an idea no biggy


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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 7:29 pm 

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I still say if ur curse immune.........your curse immune. None of the rest of that matters.

Basically could have went pure dr instead of ci, thats 90dr with war, coa, myr boots,stealrends,worldstone belt. Notice thats without a shield which assuming was just a craft would be quaded with four skulls. I wouldnt be ci but i could survive the curse that isnt a curse.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 12:07 am 

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lets not gloss over this ci noci bullshit lol

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:35 pm 

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you think thats the max? tyraels with 4 ber 52, coa with 3 ber, 32 (82) fade 20 (102) steelrend 5 (108) sdancer 8 (116) wsg 8 (124) (or 11 with string) so about 124 not including if u had access to max how (which u do) so 144% dr or curse "immune"

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:23 pm 
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Before the old Ci was removed yes you were 100% immune.. After the change its now a pulse the highest pulse you can get is around seven tenths of a second and in that time if you are unlucky and get cursed your cursed for a fraction of time you would if you had no type of Ci. With that said with full ci you still need to be carefull... This change was made to balance melee and I think it should stay the way it is... If they want to bring fade back on a wep I would make it charges not oskill..Only reason I said in the past to bring full ci back was it was what many of the people wanted talking to them playing Hu.. 8-)

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 6:39 pm 

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First I know could go higher then 90 but most of my chars need life/dex/str as well as dr.

A good character is a mix of all the available mods.

And I am refering specifically to the new "confuse" curse that rapes ias, fcr, and dr. I even agree that the curse should be there. I am just saying that if it's a curse, then the same laws that apply to other curses should apply. Not have one curse thats immune from ci. Also I looked in patch notes. I couldn't find anything about negating ci for any curse at all. Maybe I just missed something.

That being said , besides melee being totally garbage this patch, this is the only other real mistake imho. The rest pale by comparison. Lots O' Love
LOL

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:21 pm 

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blinky99 wrote:
what if decrep also had some sort of life drain effect on monsters [psn or what not], that would make it a pretty useful curse,

-that way you could give it a synergy and you'd actually have a curse that causes damage and can directly kill monsters

this wouldnt work too well cause wb the heal reset counter for a boss if you were trynna solo something with it n just tele away i mean it would have to have an initial hit aswell to reset heals and therefore spamming it would also be effective.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:45 pm 
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If enabled it wouldn't reset the heal timer, so it would just be a trash skill anyway

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Wed Apr 11, 2012 12:46 am 
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Asteroth wrote:
Before the old Ci was removed yes you were 100% immune.. After the change its now a pulse the highest pulse you can get is around seven tenths of a second and in that time if you are unlucky and get cursed your cursed for a fraction of time you would if you had no type of Ci. With that said with full ci you still need to be carefull... This change was made to balance melee and I think it should stay the way it is... If they want to bring fade back on a wep I would make it charges not oskill..Only reason I said in the past to bring full ci back was it was what many of the people wanted talking to them playing Hu.. 8-)


You're doing it wrong. You can still become 100% Curse Immune in this patch. The pulse you're talking about is when you're using Cleansing with high amounts of Curse Reduction. Cleansing's curse reduction doesn't function the same as other forms of curse reduction and will allow you to be cursed for very brief amount of time.
If you reach 100% or more Curse Reduction through Fade, Redemption and the item modifier, you will not be affected by any curse outside of Confuse.


Pappy wrote:
Also I looked in patch notes. I couldn't find anything about negating ci for any curse at all. Maybe I just missed something.


I believe it was an unexpected result from changing the Necromancer Confuse skill to stack with other curses. This was probably done by making Confuse not register as cursing a player/monster, thus curse immunity would have no effect on it.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:58 pm 

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nope no cleansing here

73 percent from fade, 17 from craft holy armor, 25 from redemption on my claw =115 total, until i can manage level 60 fade where ill be at 75 percent and can skip the claw for something with more damage.

That being said its still just the confuse curse thats off. Pretty much wrecked the whole ci idea, no reason to even bother goin ci if u cant be completely ci.

gonna switch over to pure dr, same skill loss, same res, less damage taken when amped and confused. For the gear and time investment hard percentage dr seems to stack up to be better deal. I'll let yall know how it turns out.

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 Post subject: Re: CI my ass?
PostPosted: Sat May 19, 2012 3:16 pm 

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Yep switching to just tanking gear ie tyreals, coa, and skulled shield for phys boss works way better then going ci......for all other boss go double claw. If I really wanted to stack it on ide load of on worlstone belt and the 95 boots.

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