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 Post subject: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2018 12:49 pm 

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:09 am
Posts: 114
(What im about to say applies to many other mods as well..)

Most Skill lvl requirement is meaningless

MOST skills could be obtainable at lvl 1 and there is absolutely 0 balance issues.
For example, Leap. Why it requires lvl 6 or so? :D Think about it. Its just funny.
Same goes for skill such as Leap Attack, Bash, Stun, Concentrate, Double Swing, Double Throw, Berserk. Those skills do different things and its just up to the play style/build of each person to choose what he wants.
At the current stage only Frenzy and WW (maybe WW?) might be kind of too strong for starting lvls. Frenzy is certainly superior to Double Swing so it makes sense that it requires higher lvl. BUT if thats the case, then why even bother having Double Swing in the first place? Its just another useless skill like Leap. I mean, even if u keep the lvl requirements, that doesnt make Double Swing or Leap any more useful. I honestly dont know what could be done with Leap to improve it but if u want to make Double Swing comparable to Frenzy, maybe make it deal a lot more dmg compare to Frenzy (since Frenzy is all about speed).
So there is no reason to NOT be able to learn these skills at lvl 1 considering the meaningful limited factor are the skill points.
OFc barb is just the example. Same way of thinking applies to all classes.

Monster density too high

I know that the mod is meant for many ppl and not solo. But if u go solo and single target build the monster density it so annoying.
I just dont see why i have to kill them, yet they are annoying following u around.
Its like the game forces u to go AOE build.

Charms

Same thing in many other mods, they fill your inventory.
Why not just get rid of all charms? :D OR make them the rarest drop in the game so that u even forget they exist until u pick up one, PLUS keep only the small ones and get rid of the medium and large.

Healing Potions

60% hp in 6 seconds is kind of OP. I think 60% HP in 10-12 seconds sounds better. (less spammy) Forces more careful playstyle.
And why do they drop so often?:)

2Handed vs 1Handed weapons

I have seen one mod addressing this issue (Eastern Sun). Btw same issue exists in Torchlight 2.
In D2 1hand + shield or offhand are almost in all cases preferable to 2hands (yes 2hands melee are weak).
I would suggest boosting them in some way.

---
I think this is mainly it. i have some other not-liking but ill skip them :D


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2018 3:50 pm 

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:09 am
Posts: 114
no comments? i feel so lonely :(
where am i wrong or ignorant?


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2018 6:41 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2012 7:24 pm
Posts: 868
Skill level requirements do have a purpose in that there are only 5 tiers of growth for spells in this game, and each tier gives you more "bang for your buck" on damage, i.e. going from level 29 to 30 on a spell often adds a lot more damage than going from level 4 to 5.

So for some skills like Hydra, if you could use that at level 1, we'd have to really tank the growth of the first couple tiers at least, but to make the high tiers the same as they are now, you'd have to all of a sudden have these massive jumps in damage to compensate. I can't even remember exactly what level the tiers are to be honest, but I think tier 3 starts at like 20? So once you had skill level 20 (including +skill items) your damage would like triple or something, and that's just dumb. If there are other mods that let you get Hydra at level 1, then their skill gains/items/monster progression must be completely different, OR you'd have to leave the skills as completely linear in growth through all tiers, which again, means you'd have to have very OP items for late game that give you like 25% fire damage per item to make up for the shitty base spell scaling. You can operate this way, but this is not how HU operates.

The rest of your post is all opinion, and I think just about everyone would disagree with most of it. :P


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 1:45 am 

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:09 am
Posts: 114
cool :)
I want to insist on charms. I think they defeat the purpose of the inventory itself. Just make the game more frustrating.


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:15 am 
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Use the cube....

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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:20 am 

Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2012 7:24 pm
Posts: 868
Mrawskrad wrote:
Use the cube....


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:08 am 

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:09 am
Posts: 114
right, well i havent seen how "fixed" cube works with charms.


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:26 am 
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i mean use the cube to put items in when you pick them up

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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:05 am 

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:09 am
Posts: 114
oh.. so the cube is the inventory...


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 12:18 pm 
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I am not sure that I understand why you would want to keep small charms only. It goes against your entire argument.
That said, please don't remove them. It would require another rebalance. This is not something trivial.

As for no skill reqs. Every rpg i have played has some sort of level requirement. Without them, there is little sense of progression, AoE would have to be nerfed to the ground (hurricane lvl 1? nty).

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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2018 1:36 pm 

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:09 am
Posts: 114
As the title says: this was a first glance review / rant, plus im noob to HU.
This is more like a discussion, hope something useful comes from it.

So, why suggesting only small charms goes against my argument?? im confused here :D

Meaningful progression is good, but meaningless and forced progression is the delusion of prograssion. Basically what i am saying is that the skill that requires lvl 6 must be truly better than the one that requires lvl 1.

When it comes to balancing. AOE skills should always do less dmg than single target skills. Its common sense, if your AOE does more dmg than the ST skill then why even pick the ST skill in the first place?


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 9:31 am 

Joined: Sat May 04, 2013 7:53 pm
Posts: 33
I've always felt like there should be a separate inventory, or at least a dedicated part of the inventory reserved purely for charms. I've seen at least one other mod do this, and it worked well enough.


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:34 am 

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:09 am
Posts: 114
yeah cause charms defeat the purpose of the inventory. it requires a little honesty to admit that, but well you know how fun boys are :)

Dedicated inventory would require coding. I think my suggestion above is something every mod should do. It increases the value of charms and adds more endgame content.
OR
another suggestion would be. Limit the number of the charms u can have in inventory. Dont know if this requires coding.


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 12:56 pm 

Joined: Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:19 pm
Posts: 2
I remember Path of Diablo have that. In reality you don't really need this - only thing you have to do is to never fill more than half of your inventory with charms :P


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 8:53 pm 

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:16 am
Posts: 121
D2 item management always feels a bit clunky, even with plugy.
The way it is now the cube is the place to carry around items while the inventory is filled with charms. That makes the cube unusable for most of the time.
I would like a second cube!
One for carrying items and one, smaller one, for actual of cube recipes.


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 11:48 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 5:20 pm
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Location: Central America - Honduras - S.P.S.
solution... infinite cube carry.... :p


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 11:54 am 

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:09 am
Posts: 114
Here is a quick improvement on the mod.
Highly reduce the amount of chests, barrels and all the similar item containers. THEN, increase their chance to drop unique/set items (since yellows are useless anyway).
Right now they (the containers) are ALL OVER THE place, so u have two choices, open them every 5-10 meters or IGNORE THEM ALL. Both choices are awful.
The point of the game isnt to run around opening chests... Those *present containers* ARE part of the game but should stay very minimal. Call them **Present Containers**.
My suggestion will make them truly unique and a wanted feature. Players will actually be happy to find a chest, barrel etc.
Hope you appreciate the great suggestion i am sharing with you, i could go more deep about them but ill cut it here.

And if u think what i suggest is bad then u shouldnt create any game in the first place ! :D (brutal ! ).


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2018 8:58 am 

Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2012 7:24 pm
Posts: 868
Well okay, maybe that isn't a "bad" suggestion, but to say this is a quick improvement is foolish. Changing the spawns of barrels and chests in every static and random gen map, as well as their treasureclasses, would be a monumental task, for something really quite trivial. This is just something that would take forever to accomplish and no one has the desire to bother with.


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2018 10:57 am 

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:09 am
Posts: 114
oh... i see.


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2018 10:59 am 

Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2017 3:35 am
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Quote:
And if u think what i suggest is bad then u shouldnt create any game in the first place !


I don't believe that it is possible to pack more irony into a single sentence.


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2018 1:03 pm 

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 2:09 am
Posts: 114
: )


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 6:48 am 

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:16 am
Posts: 121
I just saw that the mod 'Path of Diablo' has split the inventory in two sections. The upper part is for items and the lower part for charms. Charms only work if they are placed in the lower part. This arrangement seems like a neat design.


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2018 7:54 am 

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:16 am
Posts: 121
This is also from Path of diablo:
"Transferring items to and from the stash or cube can be done easily by control-clicking items. You can even drop items to the ground in a single click. This greatly reduces time spent on inventory management."


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 Post subject: Re: first glance review/rant on HU and how to improve it?
PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2018 7:16 am 
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Not sure if there are code editors around here any more, but if you want a section of the inventory to be the only place charms work just do this:
Ps. This doesn't need a reset, and can be applied at any time.

Code:
===========================================
adding an active charm area to inventory
Code:
Originals
D2Common: (6010000 base)
0606FE70   . 56             PUSH ESI
0606FE71   . 8B7424 08      MOV ESI,DWORD PTR SS:[ESP+8]
0606FE75   . 85F6           TEST ESI,ESI
0606FE77   . 74 32          JE SHORT D2Common.0606FEAB
0606FE79   . 8B0E           MOV ECX,DWORD PTR DS:[ESI]
0606FE7B   . 83F9 04        CMP ECX,4
0606FE7E   . 75 31          JNZ SHORT D2Common.0606FEB1
0606FE80   . 8B46 14        MOV EAX,DWORD PTR DS:[ESI+14]
0606FE83   . 85C0           TEST EAX,EAX
0606FE85   . 74 0C          JE SHORT D2Common.0606FE93
0606FE87   . 8B40 18        MOV EAX,DWORD PTR DS:[EAX+18]
0606FE8A   . 25 00010000    AND EAX,100
0606FE8F   . 85C0           TEST EAX,EAX
0606FE91   . 75 18          JNZ SHORT D2Common.0606FEAB
0606FE93   > 83F9 04        CMP ECX,4
0606FE96   . 75 19          JNZ SHORT D2Common.0606FEB1
0606FE98   . 8B46 14        MOV EAX,DWORD PTR DS:[ESI+14]
0606FE9B   . 85C0           TEST EAX,EAX
0606FE9D   . 74 12          JE SHORT D2Common.0606FEB1
0606FE9F   . 8B40 18        MOV EAX,DWORD PTR DS:[EAX+18]
0606FEA2   . 25 00400000    AND EAX,4000
0606FEA7   . 85C0           TEST EAX,EAX
0606FEA9   . 74 06          JE SHORT D2Common.0606FEB1
0606FEAB   > 33C0           XOR EAX,EAX
0606FEAD   . 5E             POP ESI
0606FEAE   . C2 0800        RETN 8
0606FEB1   > 6A 0D          PUSH 0D
0606FEB3   . 56             PUSH ESI
0606FEB4   . E8 27DEFFFF    CALL D2Common.0606DCE0
0606FEB9   . 85C0           TEST EAX,EAX
0606FEBB   . 75 04          JNZ SHORT D2Common.0606FEC1
0606FEBD   . 5E             POP ESI
0606FEBE   . C2 0800        RETN 8
0606FEC1   > 833E 04        CMP DWORD PTR DS:[ESI],4
0606FEC4   . 75 0E          JNZ SHORT D2Common.0606FED4
0606FEC6   . 8B46 14        MOV EAX,DWORD PTR DS:[ESI+14]
0606FEC9   . 85C0           TEST EAX,EAX
0606FECB   . 74 07          JE SHORT D2Common.0606FED4
0606FECD   . 8A48 45        MOV CL,BYTE PTR DS:[EAX+45]
0606FED0   . 84C9           TEST CL,CL
0606FED2   . 74 06          JE SHORT D2Common.0606FEDA
0606FED4   > 33C0           XOR EAX,EAX
0606FED6   . 5E             POP ESI
0606FED7   . C2 0800        RETN 8
0606FEDA   > 8B4424 0C      MOV EAX,DWORD PTR SS:[ESP+C]
0606FEDE   . 6A 00          PUSH 0                                   ; /Arg6 = 00000000
0606FEE0   . 6A 00          PUSH 0                                   ; |Arg5 = 00000000
0606FEE2   . 6A 00          PUSH 0                                   ; |Arg4 = 00000000
0606FEE4   . 6A 00          PUSH 0                                   ; |Arg3 = 00000000
0606FEE6   . 50             PUSH EAX                                 ; |Arg2
0606FEE7   . 56             PUSH ESI                                 ; |Arg1
0606FEE8   . E8 5398FFFF    CALL D2Common.06069740                   ; \D2Common.06069740
0606FEED   . F7D8           NEG EAX
0606FEEF   . 1BC0           SBB EAX,EAX
0606FEF1   . 5E             POP ESI
0606FEF2   . F7D8           NEG EAX
0606FEF4   . C2 0800        RETN 8                                   ; Change to a JMP (free space)
 
New:
0606FEF4     E9 81D60200    JMP D2Common.0609D57A                    ; jump to free space
 
===================================================================================================
Code in free space:
0609D579     90             NOP
0609D57A     85C0           TEST EAX,EAX
0609D57C     75 03          JNZ SHORT D2Common.0609D581
0609D57E     C2 0800        RETN 8                                   ;  FALSE if reqs not met
0609D581     8B4424 04      MOV EAX,DWORD PTR SS:[ESP+4]
0609D585     8B40 2C        MOV EAX,DWORD PTR DS:[EAX+2C]
0609D588     8378 0C 04     CMP DWORD PTR DS:[EAX+C],4               ;  posX left border
0609D58C     72 1A          JB SHORT D2Common.0609D5A8
0609D58E     8378 0C 06     CMP DWORD PTR DS:[EAX+C],6               ;  posX right border
0609D592     72 14          JB SHORT D2Common.0609D5A8
0609D594     8378 10 00     CMP DWORD PTR DS:[EAX+10],0              ;  PosY top border
0609D598     72 0E          JB SHORT D2Common.0609D5A8
0609D59A     8378 10 05     CMP DWORD PTR DS:[EAX+10],5              ;  posY, bottom border
0609D59E     77 08          JA SHORT D2Common.0609D5A8
0609D5A0     B8 01000000    MOV EAX,1                                ;  return TRUE
0609D5A5     C2 0800        RETN 8
0609D5A8     33C0           XOR EAX,EAX                              ;  return false
0609D5AA     C2 0800        RETN 8
Charm space = 6 slots high, 4 slots wide. Position is right side of inv.
 

D2Client edit for red background on charms outside the zone:
6FAA0000 BASE Original:
-----------------
6FAE1180   6A 00            PUSH 0
6FAE1182   6A 00            PUSH 0
6FAE1184   6A 00            PUSH 0
6FAE1186   6A 00            PUSH 0
6FAE1188   50               PUSH EAX
6FAE1189   56               PUSH ESI
6FAE118A   E8 A39D0800      CALL <JMP.&D2Common.#10756>
6FAE118F   85C0             TEST EAX,EAX                              ; Change to jump to free space
6FAE1191   0F84 EC000000    JE D2Client.6FAE1283
 
New:
6FAE118F   E9 6CB30800      JMP D2Client.6FB6C500                     ;
6FAE1194   90               NOP
6FAE1195   90               NOP
6FAE1196   90               NOP
=============================================
 
New code at free space:
------------------------
6FB6C500   85C0             TEST EAX,EAX
6FB6C502  ^0F84 7B4DF7FF    JE D2Client.6FAE1283                     ; failed reqs
6FB6C508   6A 0D            PUSH 0D                                  ; sets arg2 to charm itemtype
6FB6C50A   56               PUSH ESI                                 ; makes arg1 = pitem
6FB6C50B   E8 10E7FFFF      CALL <JMP.&D2Common.#10731>
6FB6C510   85C0             TEST EAX,EAX
6FB6C512  ^0F84 7F4CF7FF    JE D2Client.6FAE1197                     ; no charm = stop checking specified zone
6FB6C518   8B4424 20        MOV EAX,DWORD PTR SS:[ESP+20]            ; punit
6FB6C51C   50               PUSH EAX
6FB6C51D   56               PUSH ESI
6FB6C51E   E8 19EFFFFF      CALL <JMP.&D2Common.#10840>              ; are charm reqs met?
6FB6C523   85C0             TEST EAX,EAX
6FB6C525  ^0F84 584DF7FF    JE D2Client.6FAE1283                     ; reqs not met, make background red
6FB6C52B  ^E9 674CF7FF      JMP D2Client.6FAE1197                    ; reqs met, give charm a blue background
 
===============================================


I did have mouse pointer notes but it looks like I didn't update my pastebin before that laptop died. Dig around in D2Common and you should find what you need.

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