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 Post subject: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 6:33 am 
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Here is a list of the things I want to accomplish in the next major patch.

-Massive item overhaul. Currently, the optimal gearing strategy seems to be: early game sets, midgame crafts, late game uniqs and runewords. I will do major adjustments to bring the other choices up to similar power levels as what you can get currently. Buffing tons of shitty uniqs, adding many new uniqs, sets, and runewords. There will also be more items tailored to certain builds. A very powerful and underused tool is the maximum ilvl on affixes. I can prevent shitty 5 hp mods from rolling on your ilvl90+ gear. This will result in rares/crafts being more consistent, but don't expect to roll only top tier mods available to your ilvl. I will leave some overlap between affixes.

-Boss overhaul. The current one was hastily done and was sloppy as a result. Some bosses will return to original locations. There will be further map changes. Massive indepth skill changes so you don't see the same 8 spells the entire game. I want to use more multi hitting spells because absorb works on them better rather than trying to balance spells that can one shot you before absorb takes place. Boss counters will also be overhauled. Due to monprops, I can give bosses different skills in each difficulty. This will allow for the different encounters each time that I originally wanted.

-Many build adjustments. There will be more balance among builds based on what they can bring to the table. More risky builds will do more damage than ranged builds, which will do more damage than counterless builds etc. Classes without party utility will be improved to be stronger in what they can do, otherwise you get groups of 3 barbs and 3 druids and 2 dins. New item adjustments will further augment niche builds. I will try to fix display and lcs issues where I can.

-New content. New maps, bosses, rewards, etc.


Last edited by Sapphire Rawk on Sat Jul 05, 2014 12:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 8:25 am 

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This is good news. The current patch feels more like an experimental patch with some flaws into balance. If I can get a little help with converting item textures I can provide some new ring graphics.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 9:42 am 

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While we're on this topic:
-Giving a reason to have + War Cries on a barb that doesn't go "Warcry"
-Giving more tools for melee fighters to soak up the damage, so you don't explode when you get in melee range on bosses
-Make kiting near impossible or simply impossible (Why have a tank/team when you can kite?)
-Massively increase the base damage range on weapons and base armor on armor pieces. Decrease the EHDamage% as needed.
-Increase drop rate of cow level parts (Especially the act 3-5 ones)
-Fix + to X skills not appearing on claws and barb helmets, and make +X to masteries roll on circlets again (It currently never rolls).
-Impale might be bugged (strangely low damage in LCS when maxed)

-Buff Claws of Thunder. Blades of Ice are good when farming for the AOE freeze, Fists of Fire is good for DoT, but claws of thunder does nothing better than the rest really, not even damage. Additionally, give a synergy to all claw skills with each other similar to phoenix strike's. (Allowing us to max Fist of Fire and say, Blade of Ice and have the two synergies with each other in the same fashion Phoenix synergises with the rest, with a similar cap of course.)

-Fix Stun description to explain how the basic strike does 3/4 damage and the aoe does 1/2. If you could make both show up in the LCS, it'd be swell.
-Increase damage bonus on the Frenzy line of skills.
-Do something with WW, currently compared to stun it's pointless. Actually, if most melee skills could have a very small aoe nova it would be really great (Not at the same level of stun, but closer in size to poison vortex, but probably smaller still) so if two mobs are sitting on top of each other, they both get hit.
-Come up with replacements for the 4 barb skills in masteries that have been removed (Anything would do, really)
-Buff Thunderstorm (either way more damage, or much faster)
-Buff crafts one way or another. Better starting rolls would be nice.
-Massively nerf the new Blade Fury

-Add an additional dungeon to act 1-3 with higher monster level, drops and xp.( A1 could have the entrance in inner cloister or in Cata 2, Act 3 could have a 4-5 floor dungeon in the fortress of the Zakarum)
-Increase absorb rolls on items. +1% to X absorb is laughable.

All I could think of right now. As usual, take it with a grain of salt


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 12:27 pm 

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Saphire, like the ideas of revamping things. Adjustments are an on going process with a narrow window between overkill and not enough. Sounds like you have some decent ideas. One area I think wasn't explored this patch was a realm test with a beta patch. Some issues may have been caught when groups had to start new and actually play rather than using edited toons for testing. Love the idea of rethinking monsters being moved. Would also rethink the area just before Andy, too small for that fight and having several zerkers in there with the sub-boss is a bit harsh.



Riem821 wrote:
While we're on this topic:
-Giving a reason to have + War Cries on a barb that doesn't go "Warcry"
-Giving more tools for melee fighters to soak up the damage, so you don't explode when you get in melee range on bossesFighters have many gear choices to help mitigate dmg. Barb has IS, NR and inc stam, drrods have wolf/bear giving a ton of help + spirits, pallys have HS, Sins claw block (extremely good), melee zons have some dr/mdr added last couple patch.
-Make kiting near impossible or simply impossible (Why have a tank/team when you can kite?)Only way to do that would be make all boss area tiny forcing people to be in counter range virtuall 100% of the time. Problem, like the area in cata no where to run and regroup if it get too hot.
-Massively increase the base damage range on weapons and base armor on armor pieces. Decrease the EHDamage% as needed.
-Increase drop rate of cow level parts (Especially the act 3-5 ones)
-Fix + to X skills not appearing on claws and barb helmets, and make +X to masteries roll on circlets again (It currently never rolls).
-Impale might be bugged (strangely low damage in LCS when maxed)

-Buff Claws of Thunder. Blades of Ice are good when farming for the AOE freeze, Fists of Fire is good for DoT, but claws of thunder does nothing better than the rest really, not even damage. Additionally, give a synergy to all claw skills with each other similar to phoenix strike's. (Allowing us to max Fist of Fire and say, Blade of Ice and have the two synergies with each other in the same fashion Phoenix synergises with the rest, with a similar cap of course.)

-Fix Stun description to explain how the basic strike does 3/4 damage and the aoe does 1/2. If you could make both show up in the LCS, it'd be swell.
-Increase damage bonus on the Frenzy line of skills.
-Do something with WW, currently compared to stun it's pointless. Actually, if most melee skills could have a very small aoe nova it would be really great (Not at the same level of stun, but closer in size to poison vortex, but probably smaller still) so if two mobs are sitting on top of each other, they both get hit.
-Come up with replacements for the 4 barb skills in masteries that have been removed (Anything would do, really)
-Buff Thunderstorm (either way more damage, or much faster)T-storm is unique, it's a cast and forget it spell. It's never been a primary dmg spell and as such don't need much buffing IMO. Simply because once cast, you're free to do other things. The buff could be ok for a dual ele sorc as supplemental dmg, but that'd be all.
-Buff crafts one way or another. Better starting rolls would be nice.
-Massively nerf the new Blade Fury

-Add an additional dungeon to act 1-3 with higher monster level, drops and xp.( A1 could have the entrance in inner cloister or in Cata 2, Act 3 could have a 4-5 floor dungeon in the fortress of the Zakarum)Some area could be reworked like maybe the pit in tamahoe, the hole in BM no one goes there much anyway. Zak fort has an area already, that's where the last glyph comes from so leave that one. Perhaps if a new dungeon were added pick one of the temples after the general, little used ares anyway.
-Increase absorb rolls on items. +1% to X absorb is laughable.

All I could think of right now. As usual, take it with a grain of salt
Replies in blue.

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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 9:20 pm 
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sounds good rawk, all good things imo

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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:13 am 
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Here is an example of what encounters will be like. There are six spires around a boss, each vulnerable to one element and they have an aura that makes the boss immune to that element. When you attack the spires, they will summon mobs immune to the spires element but vulnerable to the others, so you will need at least two elements. When you kill a spire, it summons an invisible unkillable mob that makes the other spires immune to all elements so you can only kill one. You can then kill the boss with the element you chose, but you have to watch your attacks or the other spires will continue to summon mobs when hit. When summons die they will give an ed ias fcr frw buff to all enemies including the boss. you can either kill them immediately and deal with a buffed boss, or kill them in groups but have more summons up at a time.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:10 am 
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Interesting.. reading Riem's post and then Sapphire's last post about the different spires....

-Come up with replacements for the 4 barb skills in masteries that have been removed (Anything would do, really)

Maybe replace the 4 old skills with someone like berserk but instead of doing magic damage.. you can change your attacks over to whatever element you want for the price of 0 defense. One for fire/cold/ice/psn


to these comments:

-Make kiting near impossible or simply impossible (Why have a tank/team when you can kite?)Only way to do that would be make all boss area tiny forcing people to be in counter range virtuall 100% of the time. Problem, like the area in cata no where to run and regroup if it get too hot.

Overall, I'm not a huge proponent of the smaller room sizes, they do increase the difficulty but they also take a lot from the battle. A solid player will use the terrain to their advantage.. not just gear to the point where they can face tank the boss and hope to survive. Council members? I can kite them, I can dodge them.. there's enough space for my movements to help out. Baal (the only really annoying one)... well I better hope I can absorb a lot of damage... In my opinion and I may be the only one with it, you're reducing the skill level required for bosses but increasing the amount time spent farming up for the bosses and improving the gear required. There are a lot of positives to both sides but I'm more or less not fond of the shorter rooms.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:11 am 
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Sapphire Rawk wrote:
Here is an example of what encounters will be like. There are six spires around a boss, each vulnerable to one element and they have an aura that makes the boss immune to that element. When you attack the spires, they will summon mobs immune to the spires element but vulnerable to the others, so you will need at least two elements. When you kill a spire, it summons an invisible unkillable mob that makes the other spires immune to all elements so you can only kill one. You can then kill the boss with the element you chose, but you have to watch your attacks or the other spires will continue to summon mobs when hit. When summons die they will give an ed ias fcr frw buff to all enemies including the boss. you can either kill them immediately and deal with a buffed boss, or kill them in groups but have more summons up at a time.



sounds fun :)


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 6:46 am 
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Juvs will be removed. They only make everything harder to balance and bosses have to almost 1shot you to be difficult. I have a good idea on what tank and dps hp values will be throughout the game thanks to this patch. Boss encounter damage values and health potions will be balanced accordingly.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:37 am 
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How about greatly reducing or removing the health bonuses from oak and BO and buffing hp across the board. The mod is made for a party, but the reality is most of us only play with 1 or 2 other people at a time.

Everyone runs a BO barb anyway, just remove the middle man so we can play the classes we want from the start.

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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 8:02 am 

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I could defintely get behind a oak bo inc stamina Lycan hp% nerf with a hp per vitality buff (give mana per energy a buff too!). Eliminates these boring Druid barb parties. More build diversity please.

Removal of juvs is something ie always been a fan of. Just makes the game just a battle of preparation (do I have enough juvs?). Let's us also have less of these big hits that one shot anyone who doesn't have minimum xxxxx hp that have been put in for difficulty. Removal of juvs should also hinder the cheaters who use godmode.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 9:42 am 
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Mrawskrad wrote:
How about greatly reducing or removing the health bonuses from oak and BO and buffing hp across the board. The mod is made for a party, but the reality is most of us only play with 1 or 2 other people at a time.

Everyone runs a BO barb anyway, just remove the middle man so we can play the classes we want from the start.


I dont see the value in nerfing the value added by 2 classes because people dont like playing them so that every other class is stronger. If we are going down that road can we give everyone access to max Amp so we dont have to have the necro in the party.

Idk just my 2 cents

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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 9:48 am 
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The problem is when the value they add is required to progress.

This isn't an MMO. Not many people play and we all play from different time zones. How many people can say they have a consistent party of 4 or more people whenever they want to play?

Edit: There are more to barbs and druids than bo and oak.

Edit 2: You don't need max amp to progress, but you do need BO to avoid being 1 shot if you try to tank as a melee paladin, melee amazon, etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 9:57 am 
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Nerfing hp buffs then buffing hp per level is a whole lot of work for no gain. It will also change the current ratio of dps hp to tank hp that I think is fine. Damage will always be balanced around oak and bo because if it weren't, the game would be way too easy with them. It seems that another issue is people think oak is too strong early, I agree, but the proposed solution is not a way to fix it.

This is what I will do instead:
-Combine the power of oak and bo and put it into the same skill. So it would be something like 40% base and 8% per lvl with no cap.
-It will share a state so it will not stack from multiple characters.
-It will be a short duration buff, like 2 minutes with a giant range so tanks can recast mid fight.
-Traditional tank classes will have it: Barbs (mastery tab), Druids (shapeshift tab), Paladins (defensive tab)
-It will start at level 28 and be skillable every 2 levels, maybe 3.
-Oak will do something else.

Parties will always have one tank, and 99% of the time it will be one of these or you will at least have one in your party.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 9:59 am 

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Mrawskrad wrote:
The problem is when the value they add is required to progress.

This isn't an MMO. Not many people play and we all play from different time zones. How many people can say they have a consistent party of 4 or more people whenever they want to play?

Edit: There are more to barbs and druids than bo and oak.


This.

When boss damage is balanced around a tank having a party with big BO and big Oak, then parties are forced to carry them or fail. It's poor design to have a skill like oak sage triple or quadruple the life of everyone; the choice is eliminated.

Greatly nerfing the %'s provided by everything (remove them on rubies and gear, greatly reduce skills to no more than 50%, don't allow classes to have access to 3 or 4 %hp buffs) allows the skill to be effective but not necessary. I'd like to see some parties use the other sages (SoB is fantastic but in NM+ without oak sage you are probably dying in one shot to a boss).


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 10:08 am 

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Sapphire Rawk wrote:
Nerfing hp buffs then buffing hp per level is a whole lot of work


That's the big roadblock. It's tough to test it through every phase of the game in addition to getting it right, especially with what could be a LOT of moving parts.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 6:39 pm 
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Sounds good, it will be good to see paladins again.

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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 7:34 am 

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If juvs are removed LoS will be impossible to beat "legitimately" but I guess at this stage LoS will have to be redesigned when everything else is settled. I still didn't get to try out this patch so forgive me if this was already done; if juvs are gone you'd really want infinite supply of atleast mega heals at vendors.
Otherwise a few possible alternatives?
1. Delay on using juvs if relatively easily implemented
2. Juvs to 20 or 25% combined with pots on ground expiring faster and/or reduced cube size (sucks for farming though)


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 9:46 am 
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I remember the juv conversation being discuss many years ago. It was in the thread where we talked about raising the level of potions at the vendor in act 1. The minor heal potion does nothing when you have 2k hp for Andy. (Different conversation)

But full juvs were removed which is great, I've always been against the removal of juvs fully, they can be weakened a bit. A delay would be nice and then you could actually take balancing from Diablo 3 and just make all potions juvs in essence and have the heal a certain % but maybe a 3-4 second cooldown. I don't know the limitations of D2 though.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:01 pm 
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Instead of doing a huge change to make parties non dependant of barb´s bo, why dont you add bo oskill(or charges) to class specific items at 40-60-75-95, so you will be having bo with no need of barb on the team... so by example:

nec head lvl 40= lvl1-3 bo oskill, 60= lvl2-4 bo oskill, 75= lvl3-5 bo oskill and 95= lvl5-6 bo
And repeat with: Ama spear, dudu helm, sorc orb, pala shield, sin claws, and fuck cta.

barbs bo and dudus oak will always be better tho, but now each class wearing his unique specific item will be inspired to battle fiercely and scream(shout) into battle buffing his team '-'.... just an idea ;p

And for pots... can always make them work like TL2 pots, will reduce the stupid amount of pots you drink on boss battles and optimize your inventory space usage.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 2:25 am 

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One very minor suggestion, made it before. Caster (ameth) belt especially MS should get +1 all skills. As is, they get none. Shield, boots, glove... etc all get one. Seriously out classed by uniques, even rares due to this. Shit, you can get a one skill belt at level SIX.

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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 4:20 pm 
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Wolfs wrote:
Instead of doing a huge change to make parties non dependant of barb´s bo, why dont you add bo oskill(or charges) to class specific items at 40-60-75-95, so you will be having bo with no need of barb on the team... so by example:

nec head lvl 40= lvl1-3 bo oskill, 60= lvl2-4 bo oskill, 75= lvl3-5 bo oskill and 95= lvl5-6 bo
And repeat with: Ama spear, dudu helm, sorc orb, pala shield, sin claws, and fuck cta.
Actually, from an aesthetic point of view it takes away from the unique identities of druids and barbs. This already happened in vanilla, since a lot of the runewords have auras, special abilities from other classes and what not.

barbs bo and dudus oak will always be better tho, but now each class wearing his unique specific item will be inspired to battle fiercely and scream(shout) into battle buffing his team '-'.... just an idea ;p

And for pots... can always make them work like TL2 pots, will reduce the stupid amount of pots you drink on boss battles and optimize your inventory space usage.

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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 9:13 pm 

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Sapphire Rawk wrote:
Here is an example of what encounters will be like. There are six spires around a boss, each vulnerable to one element and they have an aura that makes the boss immune to that element. When you attack the spires, they will summon mobs immune to the spires element but vulnerable to the others, so you will need at least two elements. When you kill a spire, it summons an invisible unkillable mob that makes the other spires immune to all elements so you can only kill one. You can then kill the boss with the element you chose, but you have to watch your attacks or the other spires will continue to summon mobs when hit. When summons die they will give an ed ias fcr frw buff to all enemies including the boss. you can either kill them immediately and deal with a buffed boss, or kill them in groups but have more summons up at a time.


That sounds convoluted. Not complex, convoluted. You shouldn't have to read a raidboss guide to clear diablo bosses. You're like the king midas of shit. Everything you touch turns sour. I think you suck and should leave terry's work alone, or in capable hands.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 9:19 pm 

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My god, I think you could disagree with someone without personally attacking him.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 9:24 pm 

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locryan wrote:
My god, I think you could disagree with someone without personally attacking him.


Nothing short of travesty should recieve nothing short of mockery.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 10:13 pm 

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Oxygen wrote:
locryan wrote:
My god, I think you could disagree with someone without personally attacking him.


Nothing short of travesty should recieve nothing short of mockery.


The ignorant always complain of things they were unwilling to work at themselves.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 7:01 am 
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I tend to agree. This is HU, not median and that new boss fight sounds like it is straight from median. Revamped bosses are something that this mod could use, but lets not over complicate it. All they need are new and stronger attacks, not immunity or minon spawning mechanics you would find in median or similar d2 mods. I find such things cheapen the classic feel Hell Unleashed has that we all love. It is different and better from other mods because it sticks close to the roots of D2 and just enhances the vanilla game play. If we go down this road then HU will lose its charm and become a median want-to-be clone.

Lets keep Hell Unleashed as Hell Unleashed.

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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 3:35 pm 
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Mrawskrad wrote:
....Lets keep Hell Unleashed as Hell Unleashed....


guys this is how you disagree in a respectful way, astonishing, I know

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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:30 pm 

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Delta wrote:
Oxygen wrote:
locryan wrote:
My god, I think you could disagree with someone without personally attacking him.


Nothing short of travesty should recieve nothing short of mockery.


The ignorant always complain of things they were unwilling to work at themselves.


I've done plenty of work in modding, and I think it's fair to call something shit when it is. The inclusion of random overtuned bosses, not only breaking game flow, but also, atmosphere/setting (why is thrack in a cathedral?) is nothing short of simple minded, and Terry would've laughed at this crap while brushing it off like a bad case of newsfag.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 10:46 pm 

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Oxygen wrote:
I've done plenty of work in modding, and I think it's fair to call something shit when it is. The inclusion of random overtuned bosses, not only breaking game flow, but also, atmosphere/setting (why is thrack in a cathedral?) is nothing short of simple minded, and Terry would've laughed at this crap while brushing it off like a bad case of newsfag.


I don't think it's shit at all. I've had more fun progressing through this version of HU than any of the other crap versions that were cakewalks.

There are some overtuned bosses/skills, but that's easily fixed. I disagree with them breaking game flow though, they're supposed to be roadblocks, not some easy pickings like they used to be. The boss location changes were discussed already as being moved back, and still that's nothing major to be complaining about (atmosphere and setting? Seems like grasping for straws to me).

There was plenty of time for people to voice their opinions between the announcement that the mod would become a lot tougher than it used to be and the patch start. Most everyone seemed on board with it when it happened.

I honestly think a lot of the backlash is because people find it not what they are used to and are seeing that it takes a legitimate party to progress. I just didn't realize people would be acting like someone pissed in their cheerios.

I also don't think this was intended to be the modder's real vision of a patch, and instead it was put together when the mod was dead/nobody had stepped up to make the new changes. So the patch was put out quickly instead of being another 6 month project.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 5:20 pm 
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I will say from testing certain classes out.... things are not balanced for hell what so ever.

In catacombs a fully synergized force golem at lvl 30 at lvl 30 will die immediately

In blood moor a psn java fully maxed out of course takes forever to kill simple monsters

Vengeance pallys / Bone Necros / Windy druids seem to kill trash just fine however.

there are just several classes that aren't effective at all.

Hammerdins need a massive buff I recommend adding back in at least ignore undead/demon resist on hammers.... that may seem foolish but you need balance risk vs rewards... the pally loses the life bonus by fully synergizing hammers... without that life bonus attempting to stand still and cast hammers on a boss is not something that can be easily done. Also hammers will have a hard time realistically going over 20k dmg.

Golem necros -> I'm unsure as to why a 30k force golem is dropping so quickly... are they not getting resistances? Does anyone have input into this?

PSN java -> im okay with it being inefficient at killing trash as long as it has some value as a boss killer.

The one thing I like about the original D2 and what I liked about arimyth at the beginning was I could literally make any class I want and have them play melee/dps/for the most part tank.. there are exceptions of course.. but this was one of the best things.

on HU.. hell is not balanced.. NM is not balanced.... 95% of all classes are eliminated from even advancing. Before the next patch is released high end characters should be tested to make sure that they work at least at what they are supposed to do.... a golemancer isn't supposed to be able to rape everything but they should serve as a tank and a curse support.. golems won't last as well as a barb because they have curses to help.. but the golems should survive at least a little longer than 2 seconds to trash mobs in the catacombs eh?


sorry for the random thoughts posted throughout, my roommate and I just ran some tests on high end characters to see what to build....

turns out a throwing barb that can switch between sword and board is a decent option for him as long as load in a fully fledge BOer. Windy druid seems to be fine for trash killing......


but the complaints against the bladesin use is just crazy to me at this point.. you can literally not advance with anything else at this point.. I would love to see HC prove me wrong and beat hell baal without glitching barbs or using anything like that, just through testing it is impossible to actually tank some of these high end bosses straight up. Even with a fully stacked bladesin solo I'm having to rely on movement and terrain just to avoid getting one shotted by most bosses in act 3 trav on up. That glacial spike is insane. Keep in mind the bladesin does have full BO.. I think its horseshit to require BO + oak to advance.. one should be enough.... but even maxed out and sitting at 15-17k life I just don't see the viability of taking one of those spikes to the face.....


These are my thoughts at least, I'm willing to step up and continue testing high end characters and posting feedback on how they should be balanced to allow for advancement in the current iteration of the mod if that feedback would be used.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:15 am 
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Visuv wrote:
Actually, from an aesthetic point of view it takes away from the unique identities of druids and barbs. This already happened in vanilla, since a lot of the runewords have auras, special abilities from other classes and what not.



But i see np with sorc/pala/nec skills on many items, talk about radament will and trangs set having teleport and stuff, that thing of aesthetic and druid/barbs personality, sorry but its crap, both chars got plenty of skills that makes them unique and not just oak/bo. (even tho they are just bobitches and oakbitches atm) what i suggested is to make barb/druid not obligatory necessary on the team because of their oak/bo without having to mess up their skills or remove them. its pretty simple, easy access to bo/oak, anyways, I do understand that there are other options tho.


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 Post subject: Re: Long term patch goals
PostPosted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:58 am 

Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:15 pm
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Wolfs wrote:
Visuv wrote:
Actually, from an aesthetic point of view it takes away from the unique identities of druids and barbs. This already happened in vanilla, since a lot of the runewords have auras, special abilities from other classes and what not.



But i see np with sorc/pala/nec skills on many items, talk about radament will and trangs set having teleport and stuff, that thing of aesthetic and druid/barbs personality, sorry but its crap, both chars got plenty of skills that makes them unique and not just oak/bo. (even tho they are just bobitches and oakbitches atm) what i suggested is to make barb/druid not obligatory necessary on the team because of their oak/bo without having to mess up their skills or remove them. its pretty simple, easy access to bo/oak, anyways, I do understand that there are other options tho.
Here's one area that we'll agree to disagree. Teleport is a single char skill, it only affects the toon using it. Tele on a skelliemancer is a virtual necessity. Oak, BO and pally auras are party skills, altering them via edits or items can reduce or eliminate the need for specific classes, or build types. Think back to the medi aura on Hwill coupled with prayer ammy's & prayer sticks on baba's. Many would cry with them and park them close by, because their effective prayer levels could be equal or close to that of a pally, in some cases higher.

IMHO, we need to keep uniqueness of classes, builds not reduce them. Right now the game is highly imba, you should be able to progress without out barbs bo, druid oak, curses, or pally auras. It should be harder without them, just nice when they are there. Most bosses and sub-bosses have extremely high burst dmg, needs toned down a tad.

We need to rethink the map changes a bit, the areas in cata, to name one are too small and can be overwhelming when you drop in. The portals in those areas should be two-way as they used to be to give the ability to regroup if a fight goes badly.

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