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 Post subject: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 11:10 am 
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Gonna Start posting item changes here armor only to keep it organized. Please lets get a consensus on any changes.

**Baerk's interruption for suggestion limitations: The game engine limit for uniques is 12 property codes (and socketing counts as 1 property code). However a unique can have more than 12 mods if a set of mods have the same value range. Thus things like 25-30 flat dr and flat mdr could be combined into one property coding wise for allowing an item to have more than 12 properties. Likewise CBF, KB, indestructible, and eth can be similiarly grouped into one property coding wise.
**interruption end... on with the rest of Dew's post.

Guess I'll go first
Underlined= Removed
Bold= Changes/ Additions

Tyreals Imo Should be The Tank armor for melee
Removed mana to add mdr/pdr

+1 to All Skills
+500% Enhanced Defense
Resist All +50%
Magic Resist +10%
+50% Faster Hit Recovery
Cannot be Frozen
Damage Reduced by 20%
+200 Defense
Increase Maximum Life 25%
Increase Maximum Mana 10%
Damage Reduced by 25-30
Magic Damage Reduced by 25-30

Socketed (4)

Steel Carapace should be the power armor
removed mana added sockets can be used for facets or spheres
Variety!

+1 to All Skills
+400% Enhanced Defense
+60% Faster Hit Recovery
Damage Reduced by 15-20% (varies)
Resist All +40%
Regenerate Mana 30%
+200-300% Enhanced Damage
Replenish Life +30
+50 to Vitality
Damage Reduced by 16-24
Magic Damage Reduced by 16-24
+25 to all Stats
Socketed (2)

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Last edited by dew on Thu Dec 29, 2011 1:19 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 11:18 am 
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I like the changes, maybe add some str/dex to steel carapace?

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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 11:21 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2010 12:18 pm
Posts: 187
dew wrote:
Tyreals Imo Should be The Tank armor for melee
Removed mana and 200 def to add mdr/pdr

+1 to All Skills
+500% Enhanced Defense
Resist All +50%
Magic Resist +10%
+50% Faster Hit Recovery
Cannot be Frozen
Damage Reduced by 20%
+200 Defense
Increase Maximum Life 20%
Increase Maximum Mana 10%
Damage Reduced by 12-20
Magic Damage Reduced by 12-20

Socketed (4)

If tyraels is ultimate tank armor why to remove 200 def which make hell a lot of a diffrence for someone bo-ed by barb or for barb who have iron skin, or for palys holy shield or even for zon with iron skill and strategy. And it is enough hard to find that he should have this additional 200-300 deff, it helps alot.
Also a thought about something, armor can get highest mdr/pdr values, so gowing down for coa, and other equipment like hands, overal mdr from gear would than be like 80 or so. And to make just a bit just and inch of diffrence at hell there has to be at least 200 ... Sure u can use diamonds, but lets face it i would rather use bers to get godly 98% dr, which even amped gives me max %DR reduce possible. If we want to make it work my opinion it should look like that:
Tyraels:
+1 to All Skills
+500% Enhanced Defense
Resist All +50%
Magic Resist +10%
+50% Faster Hit Recovery
Cannot be Frozen
Damage Reduced by 20%
+200-300 Defense
Increase Maximum Life 25%
Increase Maximum Mana 10%
Damage Reduced by 25-30
Magic Damage Reduced by 25-30

Socketed (4)

Yeh I know may sound a bit op, but scaling this 20 mdr to other items it wont make any diffrence.


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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 11:23 am 
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because now u have to many mods on it one has to go and spheres add 300 def a piece. 11 mods is the max and sockets count as a mod. Also if you are tanking as a barb or druid u need a shield and i would put skulls in a ward for 24% more dr

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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 11:31 am 
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could change cara to be this

+1 to All Skills
+400% Enhanced Defense
+60% Faster Hit Recovery
Damage Reduced by 15-20% (varies)
Resist All +40%
Regenerate Mana 30%
+200-300% Enhanced Damage
Replenish Life +30
+50 to Vitality
Damage Reduced by 16-24
Magic Damage Reduced by 16-24
+25 to all Stats
Socketed (2)

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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 11:31 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2010 12:18 pm
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dew wrote:
because now u have to many mods on it one has to go and spheres add 300 def a piece. 11 mods is the max and sockets count as a mod

Thats why i dont come into balance at threads like this i didnt have an idea there is max mods load. And still i know u can get this deff from diamonds, but after 4 in it u get 1200 with additional 300 u can get 1500, and it is lot fo a diffrence.
Than mayby change likt that:
Tyraels:
+1 to All Skills
+511% Enhanced Defense
Resist All +50%
Magic Resist +10%
+50% Faster Hit Recovery
Cannot be Frozen
Damage Reduced by 20%
+200 Defense
Increase Maximum Life 25%
Increase Maximum Mana 10%
Damage Reduced by 25-30
Magic Damage Reduced by 25-30

Socketed (4)

511ed could compensate this 200 def, not sure if it will tho, but always a little edge is better. Also it is better to overbuff mele tanking powers than underbuff it, and see next ladder witout meles again. It is much more easier to nerf something afterwards, than to buff it by just a little edge without testing it to the bone.

Also there is a bit of something that run thry my mind, what if make a change in Ber and gnerf it to 6%DR and give it like 10 or 15 MDR, so it would become ultimate tanker rune, not easy but not so hard to get, and sloving some problems same time.


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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 12:44 pm 
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I don't have a problem with your tyreal's gonna update fist post with these changes so we dont have to sift through posts to see proposals. Are there any issues with any other armor?

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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 1:04 pm 
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Alright I just inserted into the opening post the iron clad true limitations for what can be done with unique coding. I happen to know enough about item modding to be able to cheat the 12 property limit a little for uniques.


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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2011 1:18 pm 
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ahh i miss counted the columns thank you Baerk

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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 12:52 am 
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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 4:22 am 
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Baerk wrote:
I happen to know enough about item modding to be able to cheat the 12 property limit a little for uniques.


Actually the properties res-all, res-all-max, dmg-norm/fire/cold/ltng/pois/throw/elem, and all-stats, disagree about the limit being "Cheated"
The limit of 12 properties is still there and it works exactly as it was designed to, as does properties.txt.

Also its not just for uniques, its for rw's, affixes, monprop (anything that uses a property rather than a stat).

Edit: regarding melee armor, is there really an issue with melee survivability? I thought the issue was with damage. If they are made able to tank better than they can already but allowed to kill alot faster, the balance of power is gonna swing wildly.
What chars struggle to survive? I can list what I've played (with worse gear than is available atm).
Pally - fine, using just orphans set and shaftstop for 99% of the game
SpearZon - suckin hard in norm/nm unless you can twink. If you have twinkables its not so bad until hell (pre 95 uniques)
Fury Wolf - fine for tankage, annoying as hell to gear for damage. Lacking in DR%/resist with 2 handers (barb gets nat res to allow them to use a 2 hander without worrying about res)
Barb - don't play them at all, All i know is pious BO bitch barb tanked hell duri without using a single pot, while my pally killed (untwinked, ladder start chars).
Sin - Only ever made phoenix and WW sin. Phoenix is terrible for survival, all her gear needs to be dedicated to her phoenix strike dmg JUST to get it to a respectable damage, leaving very little for survival. WW sin gets ww = nice survival being able to move while attacking.
Sorc - lol, i'll comment on sorc melee survival when i get a night free to finish my current one.

I don't think more survival is needed as you can shrug off most things already if you set up propperly as a melee. You just can't damage anything that matters.

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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 5:32 am 

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Call me silly, but I don't really see the need to add mdr/pdr to an armor with 20% dr AND 4 open socs, seems a bit overkill. I do like the change to carapace though.

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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 6:19 am 
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Spearzon sucked dick to live on. Other than that I've never had a problem tanking.

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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 8:31 am 
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Yeah I wont do that to tyreals, made this thread to get something kicking when all the polls were going on. People were bitchin so I just threw an idea out there. Personally idc if any items are changed that's why I asked for input in the other thread.

@Lockdown. You have suggestion for gbane? Or just trolling some times I can't tell with you.

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 Post subject: Re: melee Armor suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 12:57 pm 
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I'm looking at it. I like what it trys to do but it doesn't do it very well. Zealers are gonna probably just use it to level up and not much beyond that.

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