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 Post subject: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:10 pm 

Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:18 pm
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So I rolled a healadin after hearing about all the people whining about healadins..

Now I see why.

So A few suggestions I hope that we can work out with healing as a healadin.

First: Eliminate the summons being targetable.
There is nothing more annoying than trying to run to a target or just trying to run period and having summons there and you start throwing heals at them when you are trying to heal useful targets. Now some people might say "Just set your heals to your right click"...HAH! Well this brings me to my second Suggestion

second: Allow auras to be on the left skill side. Now I say this because it may not seem like a huge deal but since healadins can only set auras on the right side we are forced to put our holy bolt on the left side...So when we try to move...if ANYTHING gets in our way...whether it be enemy or ally...We Will start throwing heals at them...Where as if we had auras on the left side we could move without fear of healing others...

third: This one may not be do-able..but if it is take a listen... Remove non-demons from being targetable by holy bolt. The holy bolt often is an extremely annoying skill to target who you want it to target... The biggest issue i have is when my tank is tanking a bunch of targets and i cant run to the perfect side he has to move so i can heal him...and he shouldnt have to.

fourth: So pretty much..lets say none of those are do-able..Im sure this one is.. Make holy Bolt piercing... If Holy bolt were to be piercing it would eliminate a HUGE annoyance with healing and it will lead to more succesful groups...perhaps make the skill go 100% first target then 75,50,25 or however you wish to have it..but piercing holy bolts would be a give from god and no one would complain about it.
Anyways ^^


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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:23 pm 
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Auras on left click will crash the game
not being able to target demons would most likely require hardcoding and remove any little bit of skill to use the build
holy bolts only collide with undead,players,hirelings and pets the rest it pierces it just doesn't happen to heal when it does pierce skill function limitation.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:29 pm 

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So annoyance correlates with skill you're implying? I dont see why healadins should have the most annoying class to play. Removing a minor annoyance in healing does not eliminate skill.


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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:41 pm 
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Well tbh I never found a healadin annoying if I couldn't get the heals to the tank I would move or tell him he needed to move depending on the situation.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:43 pm 
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What dew just said basically struck me as it can't heal if it pierces something. What he said about auras is true unfortunately. In short the skills are the way they are due to engine limitations that make them "annoying" to use. As far as I'm concerned though being mindful of combat positions and putting them to your advantage is part of skill and tactics.


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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:00 pm 
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click leftclick skill icon. Hover over normal attack. Press f5. hover over holy bolt. press f6. Run around as normal and switch to holy bolt when you need to heal someone.
If you cant hit the tank because of summons, move to the side. Playing a healer is all about positioning for maximum effect.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 4:02 am 
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People shouldn't need summons with a healer in the party anyway.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 12:05 pm 

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I've been playing a healer this patch. I don't think there is anything wrong with the holy bolt skill except for one thing... the targeting of monsters that it cannot hit. Like when it targets an act boss even though act bosses are demons and it cannot hit demons, only undead. Maybe this can be removed? I believe when it targets a monster it cannot hit, it will still cause counters. This is the only issue i think with the skill. Other than that, holy bolt is fine. And if it is left unchanged, i wouldn't really care anyway...it really is all about maximizing where you are in relation to the other players/monsters/summons. In my eyes, its a great way to really see how well your team plays together... the idiots will be the ones who will stand in the way or cast decoy/summons in between the path of the holy bolts from healer to tank.


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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 9:36 pm 
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LockDown wrote:
People shouldn't need summons with a healer in the party anyway.

srsly.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 4:48 am 
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THere is nothing wrong with healers .. I'm playing one now and I have no problems with healing anyone ... Ever think it might be the player playing them that sux and not the build.. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 7:23 am 
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It may also be the fact that you could be healing idiots. If people don't unsommon during important fights to let the tank receive heals you're dealing with incompetence and for that there is no solution.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:51 am 

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IDK how many times I had to ask repeatedly during boss fights for no summons. A small part is language barrier the rest is ignorance. Part of why I dislike doing bosses in pubs.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 4:47 pm 
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Agreed that and if the summons last long enough to land a hit then you have extra counters procing. Which just adds unnecessary difficulty.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 6:56 pm 

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At least I am getting some support out of this thread. Appreciate all who support ^^


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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:35 am 
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I disagree with these suggestions as it encourages more zombie like play and less skill based play. A healadin is already a fairly low skill build to play, no need to simplify it even further. This mod is designed to be challenging and I think that standard should be maintained.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 8:05 pm 

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Oh right. So being forced to run into a group of mobs just to heal your tank who is being blocked by massive summons is ok?

I'm sorry but I dont quite understand your argument here. You are saying that healing in Hell Unleashed is easy? Saying that its a "low skill" build is a rather arrogant statement to make. Ive healed my way into hell and up to diablos mini bosses. It is a never ending job in hell. Its not as casual or leisurely as dpsing.

But if you feel as though you can elaborate on the skill level required to play a healer VS your high skill cap DPS classes then by all means go for it.


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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:27 pm 
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If you get mobbed you aren't doing something right at all. I suppose this game has a low skill floor and a lot of bad people can make it pretty far into the game. But to say every DPS class is easy is even dumber. Try playing a spearzon and let me know how far you get.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:47 pm 
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zeras wrote:
Oh right. So being forced to run into a group of mobs just to heal your tank who is being blocked by massive summons is ok?

whoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooosshhhhhhhhhhhhhh

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2011 11:30 pm 

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LockDown wrote:
If you get mobbed you aren't doing something right at all. I suppose this game has a low skill floor and a lot of bad people can make it pretty far into the game. But to say every DPS class is easy is even dumber. Try playing a spearzon and let me know how far you get.


I never said that nor was that my implication.


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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 12:22 am 
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zeras wrote:

But if you feel as though you can elaborate on the skill level required to play a healer VS your high skill cap DPS classes then by all means go for it.


You did.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 4:51 am 
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If your tank needs more healing than auras can provide when against trash then there is something wrong with your tank.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:37 pm 

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LockDown wrote:
zeras wrote:

But if you feel as though you can elaborate on the skill level required to play a healer VS your high skill cap DPS classes then by all means go for it.


You did.


No. I didnt. It was a serious statement. I told you to elaborate on actual high skill cap dps classes.

If you dont understand this then I guess we are at a wall then.


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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 4:11 pm 
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20 Holy Bolt
20 Prayer
1 Cleansing
1 Medi
10 into res auras
Max Salv
Dump Holy Shield

AFK TANK PALLY!!!!!!

Prove me wrong. Healer's are by far the easiest thing to play. Insight + Purity = 3 Sources of HIGH level prayer when running cleansing or prayer. It's not my fault that you are either A) A bad player or B) constantly stuck with idiots.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 5:37 pm 
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why max salvation? surely should have enough defensive soft points to get the res all high enough unless im missing something?

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 5:45 pm 

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Yea maxing salvation is a bad idea really... its diminishing returns is huge. 1 point gets it 65+ all res end game. If anything, those points are better spent into finishing up the res auras.


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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 7:18 pm 
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20 All Res Auras
1 Pt Salv
20 Prayer

Afk my bad <_<

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:39 am 
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Sounds boring :(

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:26 am 
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PureRage-DoD wrote:
Sounds boring :(



Not if you enjoy sandwiches.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 5:34 am 
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better to eat sandwitches while you follow the party through the trash mobs and gain exp while doing it. Especially when you can be dealing very sygnificant damage to end the boss fight sooner.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 7:01 am 
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significant damage? I hope you are referring to the rest of the party and mercs. That skill build is purely defensive aside from the max holy bolt.


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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 7:39 am 
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My point. ---> :idea:



Your head. ---> :idea:

I'm not talking about that skill plan obviously, especially as its a 100 point build, so salvation absorb won't even be much use vs a single point resist aura until mid hell.
10% extra absorb to a single element for a 20 point investment is not what I would call, a good return. 60 points for 20 all absorb when 99% of the time, the main damage is coming from 1 element and you can run a single resist aura + equip a ring. Those 60 points can be put to much better use allowing you to contribute offensively and defensively and do both very well. It's not a crime for people to have to use a rejuv or 2.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 8:17 am 
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PureRage-DoD wrote:
better to eat sandwitches while you follow the party through the trash mobs and gain exp while doing it. Especially when you can be dealing very sygnificant damage to end the boss fight sooner.



I think my point was that sandwiches are delicious but sometimes my fiance is at work and can't make me these sandwiches so I have to afk :(

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 8:29 am 
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Use holy bolt + windowed mode to follow a team mate through the trash ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 9:08 am 
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I only play windowed full screen limits my ability to watch movies on the other screen as it does weird things to my resolution. :D

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 9:59 am 
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Please, someone like me like to put the char up in front of the boss and go afk..
Let us do it.


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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 3:56 pm 
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PureRage-DoD wrote:
60 points for 20 all absorb when 99% of the time, the main damage is coming from 1 element and you can run a single resist aura + equip a ring. Those 60 points can be put to much better use


then maybe this part is the issue. the benefit from spending 60 points is terribly low. You get so much more from your 20 in prayer than you do from 60 into res auras for an extra 10%. atleast change up the synergies so an auradin can max fanat/conc/conviction instead of investing the bulk of his points into synergies for salvation.

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 Post subject: Re: Healadin tweaks.
PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:10 pm 

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ok ive made 1 healer EVER and it got to lvl 99, almost 100, started with no gear, only time i ever had a problem healing people was when there was... sorry no memory? its such a low skill build as is, impossibly tank, impossibly easy, all u need to do is charge or tele for half a second and your back in business... only problem with a healer is its boss soloing in hell but it can still easily solo hell andy and i dunno what else... now this char was last ladder but only thing it struggled to solo was like hell mephy, hell dia, and hell baal. everything else was wayy to easy. i think leave it as is... if ur party cannot adapt and listen to their party leader (theres always one just have to look) then they DO NOT deserve to be healed... oh also this healer was hc so even more reason to leave them the same...

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