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 Post subject: is it too late for suggesting 1.7 uniques?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2016 6:33 pm 

Joined: Sat Sep 26, 2009 9:52 pm
Posts: 26
disclamer: i was unable to get a piece of the 1.7 public testing action, but im pretty sure this niche will still be unfufilled anyway

i would like to suggest a new unique elite warhammer; as i tend to make double swing barbs, my favorite kind of barb, and i note that there arent make weapons that fit their niche really well so im going to offer up a weapon witht he bare minimum stats needed to make me super interested in it (also since i dont know how small the numbers are relatively, so offering numbers themselves wouldnt be overly useful for anyone)


i propose a unique legendary mallet with -20% ias, 4-6 sockets, and a mediocre amount of ed (probably 150-200% or there abouts).

alright so obviously that looks weird but i am approaching this from what would be the nicest thing i could want for a double swing barb. and the notable thing about this is that high level doubleswing gear seems to be crafted, or obedience (or your essentially a frenzy barb). and it seems to nearly always involve a war hammer (or higher tierd version) for your slow weapon. this is great and all but the legendary mallet seems to be faster than its previous tiers which works against you slightly when you abuse double swing, so the less than 0 ias can work towards fixing it.

aside from the obviously weird reduced ias aimed at helping 1 singular build, everything seems vaguely in order with this item. there are a few attack types which have fixed attack speed which could also make use of a weapon like this while avoiding the penalty (charge comes to mind, but there should be 1 or 2 more), and honestly there is room for this weapon to do a couple of other things to make it seem attractive to other builds, though without really messing around with 1.7 too much its really hard to say where i think a sensible direction to take with the remaining space on an item like this.

so there is my suggestion for a (fragment of) a new unique, which nails one niche i enjoy playing which has been getting harder and harder to find weapons for, and could probably be expanded to fit other character types in some way

sidenote since its probably not deserving of its own thread: part of me wonders if adding gem/rune storage items (as seen in other mods) would hurt or help the game, has this been tried or experimented with before?


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 Post subject: Re: is it too late for suggesting 1.7 uniques?
PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2016 8:32 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 11:28 am
Posts: 1091
Location: Vancouver, BC
Gem/Rune Storage - I know it wasn't done before HUv1.3, and I don't expect it to have been done afterwards. One feature of v1.7 that kinda helps Rune management is that there are several cycles where a rune is equivalent to another rune, so tossing one of them into the cube and transmuting returns the alternate rune. Out of the 31 runes, there are about 12 equivalent to another, and it is possible to buy four runes per act (stopping at Lem in A5), so I'd expect players to be pretty comfortable either keeping just 1-2 of runes that they could transmute into their partner rune, or maybe just buying them. That aside, a GemBox sounds fun, I'd recommend trying v1.7's system for now (works well enough for me), and if folks would like a GemBox for v1.8 and v1.9, then it sounds like a great improvement to look forward to.

Unique Suggestions - I'm of the opinion that until we share a link to download the polished version of v1.7, then you're welcome to recommend items. Here is a link to every HUv1.7 Webpage produced by the WebPageMaker (a more advanced program than currently available in the Homemade Modification forum). It will take me a while to prepare a test package, if I need to, but it's easy for me to share these webpages. The main reason I disabled most of the uniques in v1.3 is because once I'd rebalanced some of them for v1.7 they seemed kinda plain, and occasionally I'd wished that they had dropped as a triple durability Rare item instead, so I disabled them and only added uniques when they seemed like a good idea (Some basic items might still seem boring).

One significant feature in v1.7 is upgrading items from Basic to Exceptional and Elite. I made those recipe ingredients more common, and the upgrade will add +Skills or PDR/MDR for item types where the level increase justified it (typically an Exceptional is 35-40 levels higher than its Basic type, while nearly all Elite items are between levels 80-90). The upgrade recipe for every equipment type is to cube an item with 2 (Basic) or 4 (Exceptional) StarStone gems and AdamantHammer. One reason this system works well enough is because all unique weapons and armor have the same +% mods from tier to tier (I wanted +100% to be as important to a level 9 character as to a level 99 character).

With that in mind, are you sure you want to wait until char level 90 before using your Legendary Mallet unique? It's no problem creating it as a basic or exceptional version (The only difference is that Elite would have +3 skills, the exceptional +2, and Basic +1, literally nothing else in your suggestion would be changed).

For now, I understand that you'd like a blunt weapon (+50%DmgUndead automod) with max sockets (i.e. its strength is versatility), and below average physical damage and speed (i.e. the balance for its strong point).

For now, I'd implement it this way:
Unique War Hammer
+1 All Skills (Standard on all 1-H weapons after level 33ish, +3 as Elite)
5 Sockets (current max for 1-H weapons, 5 ith Runes would be another +100%ED, 5 excellent jewels could add +60%IAS with +50-80%ED with more)
+55-66% EnhancedDamage (standard range is 85-100%)
+50% Damage to Undead (hardcoded automod on blunt weapons)

I could try adding a negative IAS mod, but I think it would be ignored even if the text files say they would allow it (e.g. negative %ED was ignored even when I'd try to set it up as acceptable). War Hammers happen to be slow anyways, so it'd probably be fine as it is.

Take a look at the white weapons webpage and let me know if the automods of another weapon class appeal to you more.

P.S. If you want to interact with the Prefix and Suffix webpages, then don't use Chrome (it has a bugged implementation for hiding table rows), and allow JavaScript (when you select a level and item type, the script will filter out invalid rows from the table, and will collapse those rows unless you're using Chrome). If you have to use Chrome, then after filtering, just search for text "group" since that only appears once per unhidden row.


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 Post subject: Re: is it too late for suggesting 1.7 uniques?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2016 10:13 am 

Joined: Sat Sep 26, 2009 9:52 pm
Posts: 26
That looks absolutely beautiful.

Though now im slightly worried (now that i have some context on other weapons) that it may be on the edge of being too strong compared to other uniques, but thats what testing is supposed to confirm right?

As far as whether -ias can actually be added, i have a bad habit of assuming anything you can actually get on an item in a character editor can be done to items the game gives you.

Assuming the above assumption is true you should be able to get -20% without changing the nature of the ias mod (as that was the minimum), and failing that the cursed rings in 1.3 had -10% ias im pretty sure, so even that could be done in theory.

Also thanks for the 1.7 resources, i am now even more hyped for it than before~


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 Post subject: Re: is it too late for suggesting 1.7 uniques?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2016 12:41 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 11:28 am
Posts: 1091
Location: Vancouver, BC
I ran some tests with the new unique WarHammer upgraded to Elite and compared it to the unique BattleHammer upgraded to Elite.

Thoughts:
  • IAS is still capped at -20%, and it worked just fine in game. I had changed the "swing" (IAS as it's stated in the files) mods to include an automatic durability or quantity buff (I felt that it would be more enjoyable if faster weapons were more durable, but didn't want to add Durability separately to everything. A nice side-effect is that many item's exact base speed can be determined just be looking at their durability (100 is standard and the IAS and base-speed buff is added to it)). Durability buffs can't be negative (I think this was another of the mods I experimented with long ago and found it couldn't become negative regardless of configuration, LevelRequirement is another), so that part of the IAS penalty didn't take effect. Adding -20%IAS to the WarHammer works, and the redundant durability stat doesn't hurt the game, although I felt like the "80 durability" was lying to me since I knew the base speed after -20%IAS was 60.
  • My previous estimate on jewels was off a bit, in that high quality IAS/ED jewels are pretty rare (you need 1 out of about 13 Prefixes with 1 out of about 20 suffixes). I cubed up about 80 before I found 4 in the range 7-12%IAS with 14-17%ED with other mods (note that 1%LifeLeach mod adds 5%ED, so is necessary for the best %ED jewel (ED above 15%)).
  • Any unique can still get a socket via X Socket, so at best the new unique just has 4 sockets more than an alternative.
  • Even if I've missed something, and the new unique turns out much stronger than an alternative, one of the benefits of v1.7's small number is that errors are pretty small. The new unique probably can't be much more than 20% stronger than some alternative, which doesn't really affect the game all that much. Killing critters in 4-5 hits instead of 5-6 is fine with me.
  • The unique WarHammer ("IronStone") has been implemented with the mods mentioned above (no IAS penalty), except it has 50-60%ED instead of 55-66% (although it took me 80 jewels to find 4 (5th socket is for Indistructibility) I liked, I think trading and better luck would easily account for the loss of 5%ED).

That aside, it's worth mentioning that Runes in v1.7 are relatively common but weaker (about 2/3 as strong as a Prefix or Suffix, and Rare items are limited to 3 sockets unless they spawn with the "4 sockets" mod) compared to other HU versions. I've tried to make early-game rune buffs based on a % (so they're still relevant end-game), while later runes often buff with flat-numbers. Monsters drop runes at their level more often than lower runes (it's quite unlikely to find a rune below Amn from a level 60 monster, they'll probably drop the Ko-Um range although Vex would be possible)

If folks remember a favourite v1.3 item that I disabled without consideration, they're welcome to request it back. It'd return with it's %ED balanced to the standard range, and it's IAS or similar mods changed similarly. I don't intend unique items to be especially strong relative to rare items, so it'd be excellent if folks requested genuinely unique stuff.


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