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 Post subject: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:43 am 

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A while ago, a couple of veteran druid players and I were discussing how there are really no fast, high end rune word weapons for ss bears. I tried some of the weapons with my bear like BOTD, and a few others, even beast. Sure, some of them have great mods, but I couldn't believe how utterly slow I was attacking, it was almost humorous just to watch it. It made the game unplayable.

Basically, there is one viable weapon that everyone always looks for at end game which of course is the eth tomb reaver. The Ik maul comes in at a close second. Sure you can craft some weapons and pray for that lucky roll with ctc amp and 511 ed. But I thought it would be interesting to give the ss bears a little more variety when it comes to rune word weapons. And because of the recent interest in maul bears this might not be a bad rune word for next season patch.

Comet

(Two-handed axes, mauls, and polearms...the -10 weapons)

500% ED
+195% IAS
50% Faster run/walk speed
5% Chance of crushing blow
5% Manna stolen per hit
50% All res
150% FHR
Level 5 Vigor aura when equipped
5% Chance to reanimate as feeder (the fast giant mosquitoes mostly in a3 that drain stamina)

The 195% IAS for the -10 weapons when using maul would put this at a 3 frame attack, assuming the wereform central website is accurate for maul attack. As far as level requirement or rune requirements, I haven't thought that out. Surely it would be zod, and lower. Would be neat to have it 5 runes to keep with its "5" motiff".

The 150% fhr sounds like a lot, but it only puts them at a 5 frame fhr, 4 frames would still be attainable but would require something like war or Tyreals, WSG, and some fhr charms in the inventory. This is one of the major downsides to the bear, the slow hit recovery. I feel this would give them a slight perk without really overpowering them.

What do you think?

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 8:06 am 
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Hmm, a bit over the top at 3fpa in a eth weap maybe.

And btw, no love for the exe? I loved that on my mauler, and he was certainly fast enough at 4fpa. I'd rather use that than both IK and TR.
10% cb, 10% dr, ctc decrep etc. Atleast on hc when you have to balance speed, dmg and safety.


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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 10:26 am 
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I thought the whole point of being a Maul/Feral druid was that you charged yourself up and then switched to a 2-frame skill like FireClaws. Maul just uses your regular attack and applies some ARating and Stun to it. The Enhanced Damage is purely from the charges circling you.


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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 1:31 pm 
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No Brevan, you actually need to use the skill to get the ar. If you check my mauler you can see his ar beeing much lower with feral than with maul with both skills charged. If the ar would carry then it would have been exactly the same.

And why would the point of beeing a mauler be to use another skill??


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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 2:07 pm 
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Sorry, I meant to imply that the ARating and Stun efects did not carry over. It's also why I mentioned that the charge up skill only applies %ED. The damage on the Maul skill is just your regular attack, so the skill doesn't offer you anything except a slow attack speed and some ARating. There are several other skills that offer ARating, so once you're charged up, you can switch to those. The benfit of switching is that you would have all of the %ED from your Maul charges, but you can improve upon your regular-attack damage by using an attack skill that adds more %ED or some other benefit like Feral (only the %lifesteal and FW/Run are from charges, the ARating and %ED are the skill itself) or FireClaws (Elemental damage and 2-frame attack).

I recommended FireClaws or FrostBite because those skills have a fairly easy to attain 2-frame breakpoint on their attack speed. The benefit of switching in that case is that your regular 8 attacks per second (3 frame) goes to 12 attacks (2 frame) so your final damage is improved by 50%. That kind of damage improvement is hard to make up any other way than by switching to a 2-frame attack skill.

I understand that Maul has 25% ARating per level, while Feral only has 15%, but what kind of change is that in your % to hit? The character's level is used in the % to hit formula, so maybe people need to be rushed less and level up to appropriate levels more often. Also, an Eth rune would make up for the loss of ARating and then some, so consider reducing your weapon damage by a little (I'm guessing a 12% drop?) so that you could improve your final damage by 50% while maintaining 95% to hit (you can't exceed that).


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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 2:15 pm 
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I had posted about build i was considering in the past based around those principles.

Maxed maul, werebear, lycan, oak and fbite. Using a weapon that can reach 2fpa with fbite after charging maul (ocasional hit with maul to keep the charges) The maxed fbite is only to provide some extra AR and i chose fbite for the cold effect. On the switch would be a slower weapon that I would use maul with in IM areas so I would be able to control the number of hits more effectively. It's not a bad concept in my opinion, and that 2fpa could deal out alot of crushing blows. Perhaps even considering a 1 hand/shield combo for 2fpa and using maul to raise the damage so I could leech a decent ammount back.

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:03 pm 

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Well not everyone chooses to go frostbite or fireclaws. I maxed lyacan, bear, feral rage, maul, and oak and am doing excellent damage. I guess most people would probably think this weapon is just too niche so to speak, only benefiting someone who was maxing maul and feral though. A frostbite bear attacking at 2fps already, still might like the other mods. That is, not having to find an outside source of faster run walk, a benefit to their fhr, and a decent increase in damage (although this weapon damage still would only top out around 1100 I'm thinking, based on the white 2 handed weapons I've seen). The cb isn't bad either.

And right, I realize the rest of these mods could all be attained from outside sources, but I like having a little variety. Anyway, thanks for the thoughtful comments.

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:11 pm 

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Quote:
And btw, no love for the exe? I loved that on my mauler, and he was certainly fast enough at 4fpa. I'd rather use that than both IK and TR.


How did you get this to 4fps? It's listed at 80% ias, with an uber amethyst this still wouldn't put this weapon to that breakpoint, even using fireclaws.

Brevan, the stun carries over when you've charged maul and switch to another attack skill, unless it was just changed in this most recent patch.

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:27 pm 
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Yup, Stun effects carry over with the charges. My earlier testing was in Blood Moor, using a naked lvl 33 char, and I think for the few times I was paying attention to the stun effect the monsters were dying on that same hit (thus no stun noticed). This time I found a group of Zombie minions and confirmed that the stun and %ED on the charges carry over to regular Attack.


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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 12:30 pm 
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Lorek B wrote:
Quote:
And btw, no love for the exe? I loved that on my mauler, and he was certainly fast enough at 4fpa. I'd rather use that than both IK and TR.


How did you get this to 4fps? It's listed at 80% ias, with an uber amethyst this still wouldn't put this weapon to that breakpoint, even using fireclaws.

Brevan, the stun carries over when you've charged maul and switch to another attack skill, unless it was just changed in this most recent patch.

Yea no idea, just seemed to remember that number. But I guess it was at 5 or 6, it was fast enough though.

But on that note, how do you get tomb reaver (much less a eth reaver) to a 2fpa? I'm getting it to 174% wias needed for hunger and 231% wias with maul?


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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 1:13 pm 
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107% IAS is the maximum base mod you can put on a runeword. Any other IAS would have to come from using Shaels.

I would rather just tweak sorrow:

Zod Jah Ohm (current) - clubs only
+3 to Druid Skill Levels
+20 to Sacrifice (OSKILL)
+500-550% Enhanced Damage
25% Chance to Cast Level 5 Decrepify when Striking
+99% Increased Attack Speed
25% Life Stolen per Hit
Replenish Life +33
Indestructible
Ignore Target's Defense


Zod Shael Shael Shael Ohm (Proposed) clubs & polearms
+4 to Druid Skill Levels
+20 to Sacrifice (OSKILL)
+500-550% Enhanced Damage
25% Chance to Cast Level 5 Decrepify when Striking
+167% Increased Attack Speed (107% + 3x shael)
25% Life Stolen per Hit
Indestructible

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 2:28 pm 
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Should remove the sacrifice oskill since no one will ever use it anyway. How about giving them an useful one instead? Maybe vengenance, berserk or something similar to give them a chance to battle IM?


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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 2:36 pm 
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Utter wrote:
Should remove the sacrifice oskill since no one will ever use it anyway. How about giving them an useful one instead? Maybe vengenance, berserk or something similar to give them a chance to battle IM?


ya - left it on there because Soulmancer put it on there and I figure it made him happy.

doesn't seem like something that would be useful though and I would be all behind your suggestion.

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Mon Feb 22, 2010 2:38 pm 
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blue_myriddn wrote:
Zod Shael Shael Shael Ohm (Proposed) clubs
Now now, let's not repeat the "Chaos" wands amusement. However, if Mancer wanted to add a new 5-socket club or 3-socket wand, that would be pretty nifty.


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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:40 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2009 8:03 am
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Quote:
But on that note, how do you get tomb reaver (much less a eth reaver) to a 2fpa? I'm getting it to 174% wias needed for hunger and 231% wias with maul?


Well, according to wereform central, you can't, and I never said you could. Both Ik and tomb reaver are pretty much stuck at 4fps with maul bear. I only bring these two weapons up because they are some of the fastest end-game that do decent dps. But in my opinion, the options are limited, and unfortunately, there are no comparable rune words for those types of items.

The current rw's are slow as molasses. I've attacked faster with other weapons while cursed with a high level decrepify spell than I did with the slow-ass zod rune word weapons :P. That's why I thought comet rune word would give a little more variety for those who don't choose to just max out frostbite or fireclaws.

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 9:00 am 

Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2009 8:03 am
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Quote:
107% IAS is the maximum base mod you can put on a runeword. Any other IAS would have to come from using Shaels.

I would rather just tweak sorrow:
Zod Shael Shael Shael Ohm (Proposed) clubs & polearms
+4 to Druid Skill Levels
+20 to Sacrifice (OSKILL)
+500-550% Enhanced Damage
25% Chance to Cast Level 5 Decrepify when Striking
+167% Increased Attack Speed (107% + 3x shael)
25% Life Stolen per Hit
Indestructible


Hey, I really like that idea of tweaking sorrow! This would also put the weapon at the same speeds as IK maul and tomb reaver. However, I don't like the idea of ctc decrepify. Also, no speed buffs. But still a reasonably good idea.

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 9:08 am 
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Lorek B wrote:
Also, no speed buffs. But still a reasonably good idea.


What do you mean by no speed buffs? 167% IAS is pretty buffed.

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 10:51 am 

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Oh, sorry, I mean no vigor or fhr bonuses, which I think would be a cool and needed perk. My bear walks around like he has arthritis and I don't want to vigor my merc.

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 11:27 am 
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Lorek B wrote:
Oh, sorry, I mean no vigor or fhr bonuses, which I think would be a cool and needed perk. My bear walks around like he has arthritis and I don't want to vigor my merc.


Feral rage has plenty of faster r/w. Glassglare, tyreals, WSG, COA, Kiras, Shadow dancers, shael runes, jewels all provide FHR if you would like it. You just need to rethink your gear.

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 1:28 pm 
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Lorek B wrote:
Oh, sorry, I mean no vigor or fhr bonuses, which I think would be a cool and needed perk. My bear walks around like he has arthritis and I don't want to vigor my merc.


What do you mean by no FR/Walk buffs? 60% FR/Walk is pretty buffed.


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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 6:21 pm 

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Forgot that the shaels added the FR, it wasn't listed on Blue's post. But yeah, I'd definitely be down for the tweaked form of this rune word, although decrep could really get annoying.

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 Post subject: Re: Comet rune word
PostPosted: Mon Apr 12, 2010 10:31 pm 
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One critical mod you're missing is +AR.

Not sure I like the decrep mod, too much like exec axe.

Speaking of which, add axes to item types since these are considered druid type weapons.


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