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 Post subject: Tank: mdr/dr/%dr vs vit/HP?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 8:29 pm 

Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2010 10:03 pm
Posts: 7
Hi HU buddies,

i hv a dclaw sin, and i mean to make her a 'tank' for the team.
early in normal until mid NM, i hv been having a good time tanking
much attributed to some amount of mdr/dr/dr% (30ish/30ish/30ish)
life w/ oak and bo in the team adds up to about 6kish.

(early- mid nm: even boss cud not reli hurt me much, so i have been thankful to the mdr/dr/dr%, which i believe reduced much of the incoming dmg. HP/vit wasn't a big problem at all (at that time)).

until recently, I have a bad time tanking, despite IM, some big mobs, and almost all boss hit me hardly, i got crushed down quickly, esp when being surrounded. for instance, in nm a5, i made a safety armour w/ 4 diamond, helm w/ 4 diamond, and added up to mdr/dr/dr% 80ish, 110ish, 41%, and i still failed to stand there long.

And my team and i had a hard time beating all the way to baal, and finally got promoted to hell.
I now have a similar problem vs andy.

That's about my sin's story.
So my question is, is mdr/dr/dr% still useful in late game? (my doubt is it doesn't seem to scale well w/ mobs' dmg/magic dmg? p.s. diamonds above are 3 perfect helm, 4 ms armor)

shud a tank boost vit/hp vs mdr/dr/%dr if both cannot be maxed at the same time?


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some basics of my sin
20 dclaw, 20 mastery, 20 fade, approaching venom, 5 block, others 1 pt w/ death sentery, w/ dmg charms adding up to 9k phy dmg w/o venom boost atm.
---------------------
wud also like know if venom's worth max-ing, atm the dmg it gives just show up on stat page, but doesn't seem really helping in fight?? anyone has exp here?


Thank tons :D


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 Post subject: Re: Tank: mdr/dr/%dr vs vit/HP?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:28 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2009 2:55 pm
Posts: 447
Location: Reno, NV
% Damage Reduction scales into late game based solely on the fact it's percentage reduction. Having 50% Damage Reduction is definitely worth obtaining, especially on a Dragon Claw assassin who can protect herself from Amplify Damage allowing you retain that reduction outside of everything but the new monster "confuse" curse.

That being said, I generally ignore MDR/PDR and focus on life and DR%. In my experiences (with a few exceptions, like Diablo's Firestorm), anything late game that MDR/PDR will negate, you really shouldn't have to worry about anyway. However, things like Blizzard, Charge, Tornados, Cursed/Amped Melee hits and the like deal very high burst damage and are more likely to kill you. A high life bulb and DR% will protect you from these types of attacks much more effectively than MDR/PDR will.
More so, Assassins share the highest life per vita in the game (along with Barbarians and Paladins) but no self-life buff. With a focus on life, rubies are definitely worth the sockets on a melee assassin. The life increase from being fully rubied out is extremely significant, especially when coupled with high DR and claw block.

Also, try to limit movement during boss fights. Assassin's clawblock does not activate when you're moving around, only while standing. You lose a large amount of survivability when being mobile, so abuse Dragon Flight as a means to do as little walking/running as possible.

If you haven't already considered it, definitely think about using a Curse Immune set-up. At your point in the game (pre-Darkness), you can obtain it through a combination of SS/MS craft Holy Armor and a source of redemption (SS/MS Holy Craft Claw or OSkill Redemption gloves). Not only does this allow you to bypass Iron Maiden entirely, you also become immune to Amplify Damage, Decreprify, and Lower Resist. This significantly increases your survivability (and need of stacked resists) versus bosses who use these curses.


As far as Venom goes, it takes severe gear investment to deal acceptable damage. As you're already having trouble tanking, becoming a hybrid will be a bad idea. Gear that could provide additional AR, DR%, Life, Deadly Strike, Crushing Blow, Life Leech, Defense, and Stats has to go to +Skills, -Poison Pierce, and Poison Mastery % to make Venom worth a shit. Dragon Claw is a very high damage skill and with Curse Immunity, a full physical approach is extremely effective.
For reference, my level 95 Dragon Claw assassin with ethereal claws deals ~30k-40k damage (both swings included). I could probably squeeze another 3k-5k if I hit 99 and actually put shards/anni/samhein on her, but her current damage is still impressive for a melee build that can block and bypass Iron Maiden.

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 Post subject: Re: Tank: mdr/dr/%dr vs vit/HP?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:16 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2011 5:48 pm
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nicely put zac. I find diamonds and mass mdr/pdr effective up until a4 nm. Once you get a5 it feels like 8 ms diamonds aren't negating anything. For classes that get a good hp per vita point, rubies are the way to go end game for sure.

sucks about claw block I didn't know that TT. Can you be attacking? Just not walking/running?

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 Post subject: Re: Tank: mdr/dr/%dr vs vit/HP?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 8:21 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2009 2:55 pm
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Location: Reno, NV
Yeah, you still block when you're attacking, casting or laying traps.

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 Post subject: Re: Tank: mdr/dr/%dr vs vit/HP?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 9:18 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2011 10:12 pm
Posts: 9
Quote:
If you haven't already considered it, definitely think about using a Curse Immune set-up. At your point in the game (pre-Darkness), you can obtain it through a combination of SS/MS craft Holy Armor and a source of redemption (SS/MS Holy Craft Claw or OSkill Redemption gloves)


Where you said redemption did you mean cleansing? Or does redemption add a reduction to curse duration in HU?


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 Post subject: Re: Tank: mdr/dr/%dr vs vit/HP?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:31 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2011 5:48 pm
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it does, 25%

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 Post subject: Re: Tank: mdr/dr/%dr vs vit/HP?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:43 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2011 10:12 pm
Posts: 9
Hi Abominae, hope you can pass on some advice.
I just found Ghoulhide gloves that have redemption aura and also crafted a holy armor to try out your curse immune tip. But I'm finding it clunky to use since I have maxed tiger strike and dragon tail, and have to switch skills constantly to use the redemption as well. How do you manage this? Or do you exclusively use dragon claw? Is using dragon claw alone without the tiger strike powerups effective? Do you use dragon claw/curse immunity only against bosses or lone tough monsters? I'm thinking I'll have to make a new assassin with different skill mix to properly take advantage of curse immunity.


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 Post subject: Re: Tank: mdr/dr/%dr vs vit/HP?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:58 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2011 10:12 pm
Posts: 9
Continuing from previous post, I just saw that holy craft claws come with redemption 'on equip' so I'm thinking that means if I replace the ghoulhide gloves with such claws I won't have to actively switch to redemption skill, its just always on.
What claws would be best to use for the crafting? And do ethereal items keep their ethereal property through a crafting?


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 Post subject: Re: Tank: mdr/dr/%dr vs vit/HP?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 2:03 am 

Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:15 pm
Posts: 523
jman wrote:
Continuing from previous post, I just saw that holy craft claws come with redemption 'on equip' so I'm thinking that means if I replace the ghoulhide gloves with such claws I won't have to actively switch to redemption skill, its just always on.
That's correct, using holy craft weap for the redempt is the way to fly.
jman wrote:
What claws would be best to use for the crafting? And do ethereal items keep their ethereal property through a crafting?
Best choices for crafting are Runic Talons, Feral Claws or Scissors Suwayyah, good dmg and speed base. All crafts lose their eth properties after crafting, would make some far too strong otherwise since they can always have max sockets.

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 Post subject: Re: Tank: mdr/dr/%dr vs vit/HP?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 4:32 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 5:20 pm
Posts: 383
Location: Central America - Honduras - S.P.S.
pretty sure assassin block while run/walk, i play assa, and always go running and stopped by a blocked missile or monster in the way... not sure if there is some extrange boss mod that doesnt allow this vs them, but im 100% sure i block while moving on sin... unless is just visual but i see no dmg taken.

in the other hand, i havent played HU in about 1 year i believe, so dunno if anything changed related to clawblock.


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