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 Post subject: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 12:40 am 

Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:19 pm
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Location: Reno NV
Anyone smarter than me mind explaining the difference between these TCs? I've read over the TC section on the D2 wiki, but that seems more of a general outline of how TC works.

These were taken from the monstats.txt, should I be looking at the treasureclass.txt?

Belial & Azmodan:
Act 3 (H) H2H B - Act 3 (H) Champ B - Act 3 (H) Unique B

Baal's Minions:
Act 5 (H) H2H A - Act 5 (H) Champ A - Act 5 (H) Unique A

I'm mostly interested in the difference between the Act 3 to Act 5 lines, and Unique A&B numbers. I know both these group of bosses can drop the highest items in the game, but does one over the other favor the unique 95's dropping(or simply higher class items) more often?


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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 4:05 am 

Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:18 pm
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Well thats a good statement. I'll give you my educated assumption on how I believe the TC works.

When farming Leo I notice that Leo only drops rings/amulets/jewels/runes/gems/gold. He has 2 seperate RNGs. One RNG is which roll you are going to get to drop a certain loot roll. Such as Rings or amulets or even combinations like gold/jewels etc. I believe this is decided at the creation of the game. His second RNG is what he is going to drop. Leo will drop every unique ring in the game up to Maras(I say this because I farm leo almost 30 times a day and have never seen a metal grid/icon/amulet of the viper). Same with the rings except for Constrict ring and wisp.

With that being said he will never drop anything else besides that.

But lets take a look at a different boss like Hatestorm. Whilst farming Hatestorm his loot variations tend to be much more broad. He will drop anything from unique rings to unique shields etc. Mephisto has the same concept involved with his loot. However since Mephisto is higher level than Hatestorm I would assume the RNG chances to be higher even if only by a half of a percent for higher level Unique loot drops.

So pretty much after what I've grasped a hold of in this game there is no specific loot oriented boss with the exception of Leo(can't think of others off the top of my head)

I have been told though that certain types of items are trends amongst monsters in certain areas. People have told me that items like Head hunters glory(unique troll nest) often drops much more in A3 than in A4 or A5. I cannot confirm nor deny but I can however say that my Head hunters glory dropped for me in a5 tundra.

The only thing I can really confirm is that the higher level the unique is: The better your odds are for that bosses RNG.


Anyways hope I could help


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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 4:37 am 

Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:19 pm
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Location: Reno NV
Thanks for the post. Not exactly what I was looking for, but I can't complain seeing as I doubt more than a few people that visit the forums are familiar with this. I'm hoping Baerk or someone will show up and humble my pathetic D2 knowledge.

Also quite the class act giving me the time of day after I shit all over you in the argument forum. For that I apologize regardless of whatever the fuck is going on over there.


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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 4:55 am 
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@ddrod what you are seeing there is the beginning of a tc chain. Following it further reveals the item types and item levels. I am currently working on making a page for this, but its time consuming and I have very little atm.

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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:35 am 

Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:18 pm
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drrod wrote:
Thanks for the post. Not exactly what I was looking for, but I can't complain seeing as I doubt more than a few people that visit the forums are familiar with this. I'm hoping Baerk or someone will show up and humble my pathetic D2 knowledge.

Also quite the class act giving me the time of day after I shit all over you in the argument forum. For that I apologize regardless of whatever the fuck is going on over there.



I don't hold grudges : o

had to edit. the : + o looks dumb together lol


Also, dew...If there really is a loot list % for each boss I'd very much like to see it. I never knew one existed for HU.


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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:45 am 
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Doesn't exist yet i'll be working on it later. Starting with hell act bosses. The sub bosses will follow and maybe all difficulties.

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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:01 am 
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Leo can drop Ardual's and Wisp. He can drop up to Level 85 (for facets). Nihl also has a set drop. 2 Runes Gem and 2 Uniques (up to level 90 usually 85-90 items)

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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 10:42 am 
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Quote:
I'm mostly interested in the difference between the Act 3 to Act 5 lines, and Unique A&B numbers. I know both these group of bosses can drop the highest items in the game
These lines are groups of other groups from treasureclassex.txt. Base is either code of an item(runes, potions) or hardcored group of 30 weapons/armors with range of 1-90. IE All 95lvl items' and last items in their tier (corona, ogre gauntlets, etc) are 90lvl (with exception of archon plate iirc, it should be 87lvl and amazon stuff, being wpn75) and first group containing weapon90/armor90 is act 5 (h) unique B

Personally I've never found any 95lvl unique from azmo/belial other than when used "item find"

And also, difference between champ, unique, h2h, etc etc. is % for items, every time boss dies game picks 6 times an one item from one of three groups linked to its TC.


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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 1:36 pm 
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You want to be looking in superuniques.txt for boss treasure classes not monstats.txt. Superuniques.txt treasureclass overwrites monstats entries. The treasureclass in monstats is most likely just left over from copy/pase of the base monster they were created from.

azmodan and belial both use the treasureclass "Azial", "Azial (N)", and "Azial (H)".

Baals minions use:
(In order of the minion wave)
Baphomet
Baphomet
Asmodeus
Asmodeus
Darkness

(N) and (H) for nm and hell.

Looking in TCEX.txt they use the same entries and have the same chance set.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
They have an 80% chance of dropping items and a 20% chance of droping jewelery, gems and runes.
The first entry they use is "Act 5 (H) Equip C" for hell
This has the folowing chances

Armo81 - prob = 2
Weap81 - prob = 1
Armo84 - prob = 3
Weap84 = prob = 6
weap87 = prob = 14
armo87 - prob = 7
weap90 - prob = 4
armo90 - prob = 2
Act 5 (H) Equip B - prob = 500
with 0 NoDrop
To calculate the chances of a column being picked, just add all the prob columns together. Then divide the number in the prob column by the total of all the prob columns and finally multiply by 100.

In the above example, total prob = 539
chance for armo81 = (2/539*100) = 0.3% chance
chance for weap81 = (1/539*100) = 0.2% chance
chance for weap84 = (6/539*100) = 1.1% chance
chance for armo84 = (3/539*100) = 0.57% chance
chance for weap87 = (14/539*100) = 2.6% chance
chance for armo87 = (7/539*100) = 1.3% chance
chance for weap90 = (4/539*100) = 0.74% chance
chance for armo90 = (2/539*100) = 0.3% chance
chance for Act 5 (H) Equip B = (500/539*100) = 92.8% chance

NoDropcolumn is treated the same as a prob column only it is the chance for nothing to drop. if a TC has nodropset, just add that value to your total prob before doing the math.

the picks column defines how many items can be dropped.
If you use a negative value here, the prob columns are used to say how many of the items should drop.
Ie.

picks = -6
prob1 set to 1
prob2 set to 1
prob 3 set to 4

this tells the game to drop 1 of the first 2 items and 4 of the last items.

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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 3:47 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:19 pm
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Location: Reno NV
Awesome thanks for the info guys, more than I expected.


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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:11 pm 
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One further factor no one else covered: The MF columns. The numbers these columns have have a DRASTIC effect on drops. If a given column has 1024 that means infinite MF for that given quality. Thus a 1024 guarentees a certain quality will drop as long as a higher quality does not override it.

As for the higher quality override I'm referring to... This is due to the fact that after the game chooses the base item that drops randomly it then goes through procedures to determine quality. First it checks the chance for the item to be a unique. If a boss's TC has a 1024 for the unique MF column none of the other MF columns matter since the unique chance will be made before the other qualities even have a chance. The quality ladder rolls in the following order: unique > set > rare > blue. It starts with uniques and proceeds down the ladder rolling the chances. Whatever chance is made first the rest is not even given a chance to roll.

MF values you could possibly find in TCs: (1) 1024 that guarentees that quality dropping unless a higher quality overrides it; 0 or blank means no bias for that quality (base chance); 512 means 2x drop rate for that quality; 768 means 4x drop rate for that quality; 896 means 8x drop rate for that quality.

It should be further noted that TC MF and player MF are applied in entirely different stages. Of course if you are farming an boss with a 1024 for uniques then there will be no need for player MF since you can't boost guaranteed chance.

As for the absolute richest TC though... that would be without a doubt the Soulmancer boss TC. Soulmancer has 5 guarenteed unique drops from the Uber TC which contains most if not all of the non class specific 90-95's. Though it's a very rich TC considering how hard it is to farm Soulmancer odds are people won't be able to abuse the TC very well.


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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:22 pm 
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Then failed Uniques and Sets just make you sad when you realize how to tell :(

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 Post subject: Re: Treasure class
PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:12 pm 

Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:18 pm
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LockDown wrote:
Then failed Uniques and Sets just make you sad when you realize how to tell :(


qft


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